That's a pretty neat reply Dana.
gmail.com> wrote in message
news:2f7f2e82-3f1e-42de-8c6c-a374352cd89c@e10g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
Deborah, please take or leave what I say. It's
really not my place to tell you anything. It's not
my place to judge anything in your life.... but I
am going to........ going to share something to
possibly consider.................. another way of
seeing it. My perspective and my opinion. The
way I see it in relation to what it says in acim
as to how it all works. And btw, it does sound
like you live in a beautiful place.
> Deborah (BC)
>
> I take all of this in, but I still have no attachment. I have no
> attachment to anything or anyone in this world. One thing I think
> some people here have failed to realize is that we do not unite with
> God by uniting with each other. We unite with each other by uniting
> with God, because our unity is within Him. It does not exist apart
> from Him. Seek ye first the Kingdom of God, and all else will be added
> unto you. Except "all else" has nothing to do with materiality. It
> has to do with God's Creation.
I think you do have attachment. I think you're attached to
your view of this world and how meaningless it all is. It's
like you insist you can skip over the happy dream that the
course talks about. You seem to want God to take that
last step....... but in your case you want it to be a big step
not the gap so tiny that God himself takes it. Can you forgive
this world? And how about we unite with God and our
brother in the same instant. And WE don't do it, because
we don't know how. We just have to be willing to be shown
and as long as we're sure we already know....... we're not
willing to learn.
>
> The "Holy Relationship" the course speaks of is a remedy for the
> special relationship which serves to maintain the separation, nothing
> more, nothing less. I don't have a special relationship that needs to
> be remedied this way.
Deborah, what do you call your relationship with your Mom?
With everyone here in this ng? How about your relationship
with the books ACIM? Aren't these all.....ALL.... special
relationships? And isn't the goal to let all special relationships
become holy relationships? It's not like the holy relationship is
just a 'cough syrup' and since you're not coughing you don't
need it. The holy relationship is an expression of what the
course calls the holy instant in this world.
And isn't it said that one cannot enter heaven alone? As in you
must be joined ...... with your brothers hand..... ??
>
> I haven't seen anything, either in ACIM or in the Gospels that
> indicates to me that Jesus was very attached to this world, either.
> Joy is not something the world gives. There is nothing the world
> gives. I'm the one who does the giving, assigning meaning to
> everything and valuing things accordingly. Assigning specialness to
> certain people and valuing them accordingly. I saw this a long time
> ago and quit doing it. It's part of the process of learning to
> discriminate between the true and the false.
>
You're right, the world doesn't give joy, but it doesn't take
it away, either. The world is neutral...... but not meaningless.
Haven't you heard stories of Jesus' joy? His holy relationships
with his apostles........ with the children.... with most all he
came in contact with? And his forgiveness?
You seem to think you can .... I don't know...... tough your
way through this alone...... just you and God. But you can't
discount the value of your brother........ in other words, all
the people you come in contact with........
Special relationship isn't just about romantic partners........
there's special love, special hate, special frustration, special
irritating son of a b....... I think you get my point. There's
thinking one's preferences are special...... one's understanding
is special........ etc. And the solution isn't to just drop these
things.....these people....... the answer is to let them become
holy. The HS uses the desire for specialness and it CAN
become a holy purpose. You do have a special place and
only you can give your blessing.
On Mar 10, 11:43 pm, Deborah
pumpetypump.com> wrote:> On Mon, 10 Mar 2008 17:32:30 -0400, "gig"
lycos.com> wrote:>>"Deborah"
blanketyblank.com> wrote in message
>>news:o46bt3p2cn9eotcvpqdhcrifrsstsrngr6@4ax.com...>>> On Mon, 10 Mar 2008 07:08:58 -0500, "Jimbo"
comcast.net>
>>> wrote:>
>>>>"Deborah" wrote...
>>>>> There's not going to be many people here who can relate to this, but
>>>>> what the hell. It's my turn to tell.
>
>>>>> In the summer of 1979 I had a profound spiritual awakening. It
>>>>> happened in the late afternoon, in my kitchen of all places. I don't
>>>>> know how much later it was, maybe an hour, mayber more, but I went to
>>>>> the corner store to get some milk or something. I'd been to that
>>>>> store many times before. I'd talked to that clerk many times before.
>>>>> This time the clerk said to me "You seem happy." And then he said
>>>>> "Quietly happy". So I knew he knew something had changed. He'd never
>>>>> said anything like that to me before.
>
>>>>> In the days that followed I felt nothing but a longing to "go home".
>>>>> Home to the condition one might call "heaven". Where one is in a
>>>>> state of direct contact with God. It was all I wanted. But when I
>>>>> told people in my church this, they said "You'll go home in due
>>>>> course, that's certain, but for now you are supposed to be here". And
>>>>> for some stupid reason I took their word for it.
>
>>>>> That was my mistake. Really. I thought I was supposed to be here, I
>>>>> accepted my purgatory and I carried out what I thought were my
>>>>> assignments. I did this and that and the other thing and was stuck
>>>>> here for another 30 years when for a moment there, I'd known better.
>
>>>>> I wound up looking after my Alzheimer's Mom, enabling her to remain
>>>>> in
>>>>> her own home for six years after my father died. I remember one day
>>>>> railing away at God, saying "I don't NEED this world. All I want is
>>>>> to be with You, and I don't NEED this world to be with You". And a
>>>>> voice whispered in reply "Maybe it needs you."
>
>>>>> I misinterpreted those word. When am I ever going to learn? This is
>>>>> the EGO'S world. And yes, it DOES need me. It couldn't exist without
>>>>> me.
>
>>>>> I've given it a lot of thought. Mom needs me. I don't need Mom. The
>>>>> Independent Living Seniors' Retirement Center where Mom has lived for
>>>>> the past four years needs Mom, because it's half vacant, and it needs
>>>>> me, because, but for me, they'd have nothing but problems with Mom,
>>>>> since she isn't Independent Living level. I don't need the facility
>>>>> she lives in. My sibblings need me, because, but for me, Mom would be
>>>>> a problem for them. I don't need my sibblings. I get a small stipend
>>>>> for looking after Mom, paid out of Mom's money, and the federal and
>>>>> provincial governments need me to pay income tax on it. I don't need
>>>>> them. If I became seriously ill, my doctors would need me to visit
>>>>> them and help them make a living, but since I have no intention of
>>>>> seeking a cure for any serious illness, I don't need them.
>
>>>>> Yes, the world needs me. But this is the EGO'S world and it is the
>>>>> EGO that needs me. How did I let myself be misled again? God does
>>>>> not need me to be here. Here would be absolutely nowhere if I didn't
>>>>> believe in it. That my brothers are similarly deceived is no excuse
>>>>> for my own mistaken belief that God needs me to be here.
>
>>>>> He doesn't and He's never said He did.
>
>>>>> Deborah (BC)
>
>>>>It seems i remember the Course saying we are exactly where we are meant
>>>>to
>>>>be. That nothing happens by accident.
>
>>>>When we serve others, we are expanding/extending ourselves... our
>>>>boundries...
>>>>connecting and unifying...... on a level greater then ourselves.
>>>>It is the ego that says "screw them, what about me"....lol
>
>>> Yes, it's the ego when the "what about me?" references something one
>>> wants to get out of living in this world. My "what about me?"
>>> doesn't. It references union with God.
>
>>I read you loud and clear. At least I think so. My initial reaction was,
>>yes, the ego loves martyrs and you were sick of being one. Hear, hear. It
>>is
>>such a weary thing.
>
>>Then Jimbo's post pointed out the wonders of public service (yes, there
>>is a
>>tad bit of sarcasm in there) and I kind of swung back his way and
>>thought,
>>well, perhaps it is a bit selfish to not think of service to others as
>>worthy time spent...
>
>>And now, I'm kind of back with you again. Personally, I don't like being
>>a
>>caretaker. It gets boring real quick. I guess that sounds kind of crude,
>>but
>>eventually one has to "shit or get off the pot" as they say. Some people
>>can
>>be so draining if you let them be. I don't think it's right. Or
>>neccessary.
>>I mean, if it's not me who wants them sick, and it's sure not God who
>>wants
>>them sick, then who wants them sick? The sooner we all wake up to this
>>fact,
>>the sooner we all be in heaven. If you agree with what the that course
>>says
>>about us getting exactly what we want.
>
>>"If heaven is a state achievable, then we must let no one, in no way,
>>shape
>>or form, tell us differently, lest we fall into the same ditch as them."
>>Prof. G.P. Osled
>
>>"Let the dead bury the dead."
>>Jesus
>
> Yeah, basically. Let the dead bury their own dead.
>
> I wasn't complaining about beiing Mom's carer. I haven't got
> anything better to do. The point was that while the needs of others
> are quite apparent to me, my own need for this world is not. I live
> in a very beautiful spot, and I see the beauty of it. Any day it
> isn't raining I take Mom for a walk along the waterfront. We're
> looking across the Sound to the islands and the 4,000 ft high Coast
> Range Mountains a few kilometers away. I usually drop in at
> SuperValue before we go, to ask if they have any "bird bread". They
> usually do, and there's no charge for it. They are just bagfuls of
> scrap bread, mostly crust, that would otherwise go in the garbage. I
> feed the seagulls while we are walking. It's fun for the seagulls and
> it's fun for me, because we make a game of it. I don't just break the
> bread into pieces and drop it on the ground, like most people do. I
> throw it to them and they catch it in their beaks, often in midair, or
> I'll hold it out to them and they'll take it from my hand if they are
> gutsy enough to do that.
>
> Sometimes we walk on the woodsy trails in behind Mom'sr residence, and
> that's nice too. I watch all the changes take place over the course
> of the spring, summer and fall, the different plants that come and go.
> The slugs, the caterpillars, the different birds and dragonflies, the
> grasshoppers... There's a hobby farm along that walk with a lama, a
> goat, and originally one cow, who was pregnant when she arrived, so
> she evenually had a female calf, which is now nearly two years old.
> The owners of the property borrowed a bull which impregnated both the
> mother and the daughter cows and each of them have now had a new calf,
> born one month apart, so now there are four of them. At least one of
> the new calves is male, so I guess there will be more calves in due
> course.
>
> I take all of this in, but I still have no attachment. I have no
> attachment to anything or anyone in this world. One thing I think
> some people here have failed to realize is that we do not unite with
> God by uniting with each other. We unite with each other by uniting
> with God, because our unity is within Him. It does not exist apart
> from Him. Seek ye first the Kingdom of God, and all else will be added
> unto you. Except "all else" has nothing to do with materiality. It
> has to do with God's Creation.
>
> The "Holy Relationship" the course speaks of is a remedy for the
> special relationship which serves to maintain the separation, nothing
> more, nothing less. I don't have a special relationship that needs to
> be remedied this way.
>
> I haven't seen anything, either in ACIM or in the Gospels that
> indicates to me that Jesus was very attached to this world, either.
> Joy is not something the world gives. There is nothing the world
> gives. I'm the one who does the giving, assigning meaning to
> everything and valuing things accordingly. Assigning specialness to
> certain people and valuing them accordingly. I saw this a long time
> ago and quit doing it. It's part of the process of learning to
> discriminate between the true and the false.
>
> Deborah (BC)- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
