>
> < > to bond with one's community and family.
>
> Tortoise: sounds nice but its not the 'truth' for me.
> I go to communion to receive Christ.
>
> DT: Then you're about 2000 years too late, pal.

>

> Dave K wrote:

>> DharmaTroll wrote:

>>>> No. Cats, trees, stones, and stars occupy the real universe.

>>> Mythology only occupies the mind.

>>
>> "All experience is preceded by mind, Led by mind, Made by mind. "
>> -Sid
>>
>> Not that that proves anything, but if you want to argue this point
>> you're going to have to take it up with the Buddha, which could prove
>> difficult.

> I don't really see how the quote contradicts what DT says unless,
> perhaps, you are equating the whole of reality to our limited set of
> experiences...

> 12 oz mouse wrote:

>> "stumper" newvessel.com> wrote in message
>> news:8XydnfOBSvFU6RDYUSdV9g@ptd.net...

>>> 12 oz mouse wrote:

>>>> "stumper" newvessel.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:c0udnSoU3czkxBDYUSdV9g@ptd.net...

>>>>> Hollywood Lee wrote:

>>>>>> Dave K wrote:

>>>>>>> brian mitchell wrote:

>>>>>>>> DharmaTroll wrote:
>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> Well, if you model Jesus and learn from his parables, I can think
>>>>>>>>> of few better teachers. However, if you treat Jesus like some

>>>> of

>>>>>>>>> bizarre vampire with magical powers and you think that you

>> literally

>>>>>>>>> drink his blood and that by doing so you are better than everyone ...

> Dave K wrote:

>> brian mitchell wrote:

>>> DharmaTroll wrote:
>>>

>>>> Well, if you model Jesus and learn from his parables, I can think
>>>> of few better teachers. However, if you treat Jesus like some kind of
>>>> bizarre vampire with magical powers and you think that you literally
>>>> drink his blood and that by doing so you are better than everyone else,
>>>> then I'd agree that you're about as deluded as it gets. There is a
>>>> whole range of views and practices that can be called 'Christian'.

>>> (I take this as one entry-point to the discussion among many, not of
>>> exceptional significance, but representative of your approach).
>>>
>>> What I think your view doesn't take proper account of is the symbolic
>>> mind. The human mind is always interpretive, attempting to be in
>>> satisfactory *relationship* with what it experiences; to make it its
>>> own. It is not happy to simply be dumbly subject to facts. And one of
>>> the ways we apprehend our being in the world is symbolically;
>>> non-verbally, non-rationally; in terms of essence and relationship. ...

> Hollywood Lee wrote:

>> brian mitchell wrote:

>>> DharmaTroll wrote:
>>>

>>>> Well, if you model Jesus and learn from his parables, I can think
>>>> of few better teachers. However, if you treat Jesus like some kind of
>>>> bizarre vampire with magical powers and you think that you literally
>>>> drink his blood and that by doing so you are better than everyone else,
>>>> then I'd agree that you're about as deluded as it gets. There is a
>>>> whole range of views and practices that can be called 'Christian'.

>>>
>>> (I take this as one entry-point to the discussion among many, not of
>>> exceptional significance, but representative of your approach).
>>>
>>> What I think your view doesn't take proper account of is the symbolic
>>> mind. The human mind is always interpretive, attempting to be in
>>> satisfactory *relationship* with what it experiences; to make it its
>>> own. It is not happy to simply be dumbly subject to facts. And one of
>>> the ways we apprehend our being in the world is symbolically; ...

> DharmaTroll wrote:
>

>> Well, if you model Jesus and learn from his parables, I can think
>> of few better teachers. However, if you treat Jesus like some kind of
>> bizarre vampire with magical powers and you think that you literally
>> drink his blood and that by doing so you are better than everyone else,
>> then I'd agree that you're about as deluded as it gets. There is a
>> whole range of views and practices that can be called 'Christian'.

>
> (I take this as one entry-point to the discussion among many, not of
> exceptional significance, but representative of your approach).
>
> What I think your view doesn't take proper account of is the symbolic
> mind. The human mind is always interpretive, attempting to be in
> satisfactory *relationship* with what it experiences; to make it its
> own. It is not happy to simply be dumbly subject to facts. And one of
> the ways we apprehend our being in the world is symbolically;
> non-verbally, non-rationally; in terms of essence and relationship.
> ...

>> I like your post as well, Dave. However, I'd say that it's "not

> the most helpful question" rather than it being a wrong question.
>

>> To ask if "hard karma really happens" is the wrong question,

> IMO. The system that Buddha laid out was not to sit around pondering
> whether anything existed or not.
>

>> Which is why I've never asked a teacher about it during a retreat

> in all the years I've done meditation. However, it's still a good
> question, especially when we have to ask ourselves what is really
> helpful in Buddhism and what is cultural that we need not import from
> Asia.