zehn..

let me make it simpler...if txawj teev (that pastor) preach for free
tiag tiag li.....and if lub church that he preach in is free tiag tiag
li...then this topic would have never emerged...case solved..what he
said was true.....but this is not so....he gets paid...just like a
txiv neeb...

now, going to your comment below....just as on occassions where ther
eare preachers preaching at the streets for free, there are those
'moob" who from time to time, would perform "special" service for free
(i'm sure you are aware of this...such as khawv koob, or saib yaig or
ua neeb saib as you said earlier). so yes, we should not
generalize...but still, this doesn't justify on what txawjteev said is
true, that god is free and nongod is not. you see what i'm saying?

...then yes...this
now, onto the part, "VajTswv txoj lus yog dawb dawb do do", is true.
to preach the gospel or speak of the Lord's message, does not
necessarily require a xf, compensated person, theologian, or
academically qualified individual to do so.

yawg tsuj,

"vaj tswv txoj lus yog dawb dawb do do". the literal meaning that i am
getting in english in the context you provided is, "the Lord's word is
free," and the figurative meaning i am getting in english is, "salvation,
healing, and spiritual fulfillment through the word of the Lord comes
freely."

if the figurative meaning i am getting is what txawj teev has intended, i
completely agree with him. moreover, if he also meant that salvation,
healing, and spiritual fulfillment through hmong kev cai dab qhaus qub
does NOT come freely, I TOO AGREE WITH HIM.

i am arguing from that one line quote by you of txawj teev and also within
the fuzzy, incomplete context you provided. so, if i misunderstood what he
said from the start, my conclusion on what he meant is obviously based on
mud. but, nevertheless, even if i misunderstood txawj teev, i (myself)
would be so bold as to make both claims above about the contrasts between
christianity and hmoob kev cai dab qhaus regarding salvation, healing,
and spirituality and FREE FOR ALL.

whether god is free or not, is an eternal debate. you know, the jews used
to think they would go to heaven for no other reason other than the fact
that they were 'jewish'. they could do whatever, but since...

zhen,

maybe that's the confusion...but my understanding of what txawj teev
was saying is that "ua neeb ua yaig" cost money.... and "listening to
god's words" is free. whether or not his meaning was intended as you
said, i do not know...but i do know (my understanding) that he meant
"listening to gods words (as in church)" is free...and this is where i
don't agree with him.

yaweh

Yaweh,

Christians believed(being taught, brained-washed) to believe that
everything they owned(money, property, including their body) belonged
to god. They are also being taught to believe they themselves worth
nothing without their Jesus. Jesus is everything for them. I think
this is what Mr. Teev is talking about. So, when Christians pay the
pastor, they are giving back god's money to its owne

To all,

still....the main question of the original post has not been
asnwered. Peb ua neej nyob, tsi has tug ruag, tug ntse, we are here
to better ourselves...but questioning, by learning, by correcting. I
do believe that there are very "wise" hmong christains out there, who
value god's words (including me). but as Uncle Ben said, with great
power...comes great reponsibility...and in this case, with great
"wisdom" also comes great responsibility....lying or making misleading
comments is to degrade ones personal character. where were the wise
and the righteous when such things were being said? it seems like, it
comes down to what i was saying....and to what thorspear was
saying....are they really this "stupid"?

yaweh

Zhen and others already give prety clear definition on the issues But
just to insert a point or so...

To simplify the different between the two, leaving out what Txawj Teev
was said. If you choose not to spend a penny on God, it is matter of
choice. Bible are printed in millions, you can pick one up and read at
your own pace/leisure. You can ask for God's healing, salvation,
blessing without the xibfwb. You need not to go thru Txawj Teev or any
xibfwb. basically, you can be your own church-your body, your house,
at a public park or under a bridge etc.

Can you do the same or similar in term of ua neeb-yaig?
Can you ua neeb saib and kho yourself and not cost your a dime?
Can you ask dab to heal, bless, protect without fiv?

Since dab do not have any comparable word for its followers to go by
or to listen to so there is no point of comparing.

lisnom

nce hlwb thiab tsi nce hlwb los koj puas ntseeg tias "it takes money
to go to church". this a very simple question to asnwer. to make it
simpler for you to undrestand...how about another question...who pays
for the pastor? i'm sure he doesn't work for free...

yaweh

zoo..

a matter of choice? assuming that all christain dont' pay (per their
choice)....churches are dead....god's words are dead...so what do you
say now? please, no excuses...just assume that all christian don't
spend a dime on it....so what's left? starting with you...just so
that you understand it is not free...ask you pastor to do it for
free....will he still put as much time as it is now? i think
not....you can lie and say "yes he will..." but the truth is, the
will not...

but still....it is clear that in both religion...certain things can be
frreee..and certain things are not...which still make txawj teev
wrong....you get?

yaweh

when we give money to pastor..we give it back to god...we dont' pay
the pastor? hahahahahaahahahahahah........

sometimes...i'm wondering why anyone would stoop this low and say such
a thing, to redicule one's own mind....anyone with a brain would
understand that this reasoning can be used in any god of any
religion....which doesn't explain why txawj teev would lie...

yaweh

The point of the matter is, even if all the church are closed and no
pastor is around, you can still go on praying and asking for
salvation, blessing and healing from God and still, no money is
demanded from you.