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Author: Mike VandemanMike Vandeman Date: Mar 26, 2008 04:41
Jim Hasenauer teaches Rhetoric -- the art of effective lying.... Not
too effective, huh?
Mike
Vol. 35 No. 4 | March 3, 2003
Essay
Printable Version
Let bikers in, and we'll stand behind wilderness
by Jim Hasenaur
I'm a mountain bicyclist. The pleasure of my life is pedaling through
wild places, experiencing the views, the changing colors and textures
of the plant life, the occasional animal sightings. On the trail, I'm
renewed, and my commitment to public-land preservation is
strengthened. I think that's the way most mountain bikers feel, and
historically, we've been eager to back conservation efforts.
We're troubled, though, that designated wilderness, the highest level
of protection, is encumbered with regulations that ban bicycling.
Across the country, wilderness advocates are advancing new proposals
while mountain bicyclists struggle to find a meaningful place at the
table. It's a wedge issue with a capital W.
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Author: SiskuwihaneSiskuwihane Date: Mar 26, 2008 14:39
On Mar 25, 11:41 pm, Mike Vandeman pacbell.net> wrote:
>Michael J. Vandeman
How gay.
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Author: Jeff StricklandJeff Strickland Date: Mar 26, 2008 17:01
I think you are on the wrong side of this one Vandeman. The author makes
several valid points about you and he having common goals, but because you
are a crybaby you shut him out of the table where the common ground can be
leveraged to arrive at a conservation plan that works for all. There is
plenty of room in the wilderness for transient visitors of all types. What
wilderness can not sustain is any form of permanant encampment.
But, you're an idiot that refuses to look at facts in any sort of rational
manner.
Speaking of the fine art of lying, did I mention that when you point out a
lie it's a bit of the pot calling the kettle black?
You should try embracing allies instead of alienating them. It's the whole
catch-more-bees-with-honey thing ...
"Mike Vandeman" pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:nehju35obnggiqau777kfuukk3holbb8af@4ax.com...> Jim Hasenauer teaches Rhetoric -- the art of effective lying.... Not
> too effective, huh?
...
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Author: Mike RomainMike Romain Date: Mar 26, 2008 19:26
Jeff, I also don't think he can grasp that he is isolating the very
folks that will do the needed trail maintenance and policing. There are
enough responsible folks in any group that will 'stand behind the
Wilderness' to weed out the idiots or to at least report the idiots and
make them feel very unwelcome.
It's the same with any off roading or 'wilderness' related group. Folks
like the snowmobile clubs get right pissed if 'others' wreck their
trails by misuse and they will turn in any such person in a quick
second. Like our RAMJ+W groups that looked after some trails, once we
are involved, we do tend to 'police' the trails to a certain extent and
are more likely to report someone who littered 'our' trails or went nuts
off trail, etc....
It's too bad Mikey can't get focused to the reality of the world in
2008, he is persistent enough to actually do some good instead of
chasing windmills.
Mike
Jeff Strickland wrote:
> I think you are on the wrong side of this one Vandeman. The author makes
> several valid points about you and he having common goals, but because
> you are a crybaby you shut...
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Author: Mike VandemanMike Vandeman Date: Mar 27, 2008 03:08
On Wed, 26 Mar 2008 16:01:30 GMT, "Jeff Strickland"
verizon.net> wrote:
>I think you are on the wrong side of this one Vandeman. The author makes
>several valid points about you and he having common goals, but because you
>are a crybaby you shut him out of the table where the common ground can be
>leveraged to arrive at a conservation plan that works for all.
We already have that: Wilderness allows mountain bikers to hike,JUST
LIKE EVERYONE ELSE.
There is
>plenty of room in the wilderness for transient visitors of all types. What
>wilderness can not sustain is any form of permanant encampment.
Or erosion-causing, wildlife-killing mountain biking.
>But, you're an idiot that refuses to look at facts in any sort of rational
>manner.
I wrote the book on mountain biking impacts. That's the most rational
thing ever written about it.
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Author: Jeff StricklandJeff Strickland Date: Mar 27, 2008 03:14
"Mike Vandeman" pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:gqvlu3p7v1hhit0vo9rarjqdm3aq64vl8i@4ax.com...>
> I wrote the book on mountain biking impacts. That's the most rational
> thing ever written about it.
>
It is difficult to use rational and anything you have ever said in the same
sentence.
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Author: Mike VandemanMike Vandeman Date: Mar 27, 2008 03:16
On Wed, 26 Mar 2008 14:26:26 -0400, Mike Romain
wrote:
>Jeff, I also don't think he can grasp that he is isolating the very
>folks that will do the needed trail maintenance and policing.
BS. We don't need their crappy "trail maintenance", which is designed
only to provide thrills for mountain bikers. And they don't police
their own peers NOW. What makes you think they will suddenly start
doing it, if they get bike access to wilderness? You are very naive.
There are
>enough responsible folks in any group that will 'stand behind the
>Wilderness' to weed out the idiots or to at least report the idiots and
>make them feel very unwelcome.
BS. They SUPPORT those very idiots NOW.
>It's the same with any off roading or 'wilderness' related group. Folks
>like the snowmobile clubs get right pissed if 'others' wreck their
>trails by misuse
BS. Trail misuse is their middle name.
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Author: joshjosh Date: Mar 27, 2008 04:55
Thanks for giving his compelling arguments wider distribution!
But you forgot to slander him.
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Author: joshjosh Date: Mar 27, 2008 05:05
>
> "Mike Vandeman" pacbell.net> wrote in message
> news:gqvlu3p7v1hhit0vo9rarjqdm3aq64vl8i@4ax.com...>>
>> I wrote the book on mountain biking impacts. That's the most rational
>> thing ever written about it.
>>
>
> It is difficult to use rational and anything you have ever said in the same
> sentence.
That's what the word "not" is for.
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Author: SiskuwihaneSiskuwihane Date: Mar 27, 2008 14:03
On Mar 26, 10:08 pm, Mike Vandeman pacbell.net> wrote:
>
> I wrote the book on mountain biking impacts. That's the most rational
> thing ever written about it.
What's the title of said book and the Library of Congress Control
Number?
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