Tang Huyen wrote:
>
> Ali wrote:
>
>> Robert Epstein:
>>
>>> Tang Huyen:
>>>> Shirley Knott:
>>>>> I have a neurological and immune illness and whilst I phase in and out
>>>>> of mentation regularly during the day I am aware of when it happens but
>>>>> everything becomes internal rather than external. For example, I know I
>>>>> have been watching something like NCIS but remember nothing of the
>>>>> episode during the mentation pause. Lots of interesting things do
>>>>> bubble up internally, it's very much like meditation but it's not
>>>>> voluntary and I can't think about it until whatever part of my brain
>>>>> stops flat lining and kicks back in, so literatlly just 'watch' things
>>>>> (thoughts, emotions, etc) coming and going :-) It was scary at first
>>>>> but now I enjoy the off switch moments when they happen, lots of
>>>>> learning in them.
>>>> You apparently have an involuntary "switch-off"
>>>> mechanism, by which your control turns off for
>>>> awhile, right? I think that Jigme and Fu could
>>>> enjoy such turning off of mentation, for they
>>>> seem always to be in a frenzy, and more
>>>> specifically a frenzy of mentation. Fu talks about
>>>> turning off the mind ("Buddhism can be taught
>>>> to school children. The whole of the jhanas are
>>>> nothing but turning off 'thinking/feeling mind'
>>>> for a while. It's like taking a shower. Nothing
>>>> more."), but doesn't do it, and to me he seems
>>>> totally unable to do it.
>>>>
>>>> In my meditation, I calm down, surrender
>>>> mentation, volition and control, and just let what
>>>> happens happen. At a minimum I get calm, and
>>>> sometimes serenity, and sometimes grace, etc.
>>>> My consistent experience is that the less
>>>> mentation I have, the less self I have, and the
>>>> less self I have the happier I am. The reverse
>>>> proportion between mentation/self and happiness
>>>> is very obvious. I don't pretend to get to complete
>>>> non-mentation, but can extrapolate that it must
>>>> be blissful.
>>> Well thanks for sharing Tang. When I do manage to meditate my approach
>>> is pretty similar. I follow breath, center down a bit, let go of
>>> internal and external tension as best I can, and then let the meditation
>>> go wherever it goes. Sometimes it is calm and nothing much happens;
>>> sometimes it seems like all kinds of "stuff" is clearing out and
>>> bouncing me around. I don't choose what the meditation's character is.
>>> It chooses for me.
>> Shirley wins.
>
> All the more power to her!
>
> Tang Huyen
>
Thing is, it's not voluntary. I have much work to do towards achieving
that state in meditation as I still find it really hard not to get
engaged with the thoughts and emotions that bubble up :-)
I just find it utterly amusing that I had to get a neurological illness
to learn who 'I' was. :-) It was a hard road for the first three years,
sudden onset illness like this involves an instant ripping away of
(imagined) identity to self and lots of other 'losses.' It's only at a
change in perception that so many gifts can be found in it, the
negatives just don't count any more as they were just a transition phase.
To me, Buddha was the most profound and amazing psychologist who has
ever lived and his teachings are as relevant and transmittable today as
they were in his time. Humans and the human condition have not changed
one iota in 2500 years.
