Since when did Romans have "basileus"?
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Since when did Romans have "basileus"?         


Author: Crown-Horned Snorkack
Date: Jun 8, 2008 12:58

How did the ruler of Romans became "basileus"?

At the time of Gaius Julius Caesar (Octavianus), in Latin he was
Caesar, Imperator, Augustus (and Princeps as well).

In Greek, Caesar was a name, thus transliterated as Kaisar. Imperator
translates into Autokrator. Augustus translates as Sebastos.

Gaius Julius Caesar very emphatically was not a Rex. Other figures,
like Herodes king of Jews, the kings of Parthia, Armenia, Parthia et
cetera were Rex in Latin and Basileus in Greek.

How and when did the Romans come to apply Basileus to their own ruler
and avoid using it for other rulers?
32 Comments
Re: Since when did Romans have "basileus"?         


Author: Don Aitken
Date: Jun 8, 2008 13:47

On Sun, 8 Jun 2008 12:58:05 -0700 (PDT), Crown-Horned Snorkack
wrote:
>How did the ruler of Romans became "basileus"?
>
>At the time of Gaius Julius Caesar (Octavianus), in Latin he was
>Caesar, Imperator, Augustus (and Princeps as well).
>
>In Greek, Caesar was a name, thus transliterated as Kaisar. Imperator
>translates into Autokrator. Augustus translates as Sebastos.
>
>Gaius Julius Caesar very emphatically was not a Rex. Other figures,
>like Herodes king of Jews, the kings of Parthia, Armenia, Parthia et
>cetera were Rex in Latin and Basileus in Greek.
>
>How and when did the Romans come to apply Basileus to their own ruler
>and avoid using it for other rulers?
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Re: Since when did Romans have "basileus"?         


Author: David
Date: Jun 8, 2008 14:14

On Jun 8, 3:47 pm, Don Aitken freeuk.com> wrote:
> On Sun, 8 Jun 2008 12:58:05 -0700 (PDT), Crown-Horned Snorkack
>
> wrote:
>>How did the ruler of Romans became "basileus"?
>
>>At the time of Gaius Julius Caesar (Octavianus), in Latin he was
>>Caesar, Imperator, Augustus (and Princeps as well).
>
>>In Greek, Caesar was a name, thus transliterated as Kaisar. Imperator
>>translates into Autokrator. Augustus translates as Sebastos.
>
>>Gaius Julius Caesar very emphatically was not a Rex. Other figures,
>>like Herodes king of Jews, the kings of Parthia, Armenia, Parthia et
>>cetera were Rex in Latin and Basileus in Greek.
>
>>How and when did the Romans come to apply Basileus to their own ruler
>>and avoid using it for other rulers?
>
> The emperors were always "basileus" in Greek, right from the time of ...
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6 Comments
Re: Since when did Romans have "basileus"?         


Author: David / Amicus
Date: Jun 8, 2008 15:13

Heraclius was the first to call himself Basileus. He also changed the
official language from Latin to Greek.

I think it was Justinian who ended the Consulship.
no comments
Re: Since when did Romans have "basileus"?         


Author: George Knighton
Date: Jun 9, 2008 02:18

On Jun 8, 6:13 pm, Ami...@webtv.net (David / Amicus) wrote:
> Heraclius was the first to call himself Basileus.

That would only make sense, I suppose. In times before Rome, the
Hellenes called the rulers of Persia Basileus. And I'm sure we're all
aware of Heraclius's destruction of Persia.

A title that the Emperors affected that many might find offensive
today is Isiapostolos. Equal of the Apostles.

With respect to my friend who posted before you, I think that I would
dissent from a direct correlation of Imperator to Autokrator.
Autokrator implies a self contained rule, an absolute rule inside a
single person. An Imperator ruled only with within the confines of a
constitution or apparatus, and an Imperator might have above him a
Consul, Dictator or Emperor.
no comments
Re: Since when did Romans have "basileus"?         


Author: Don Aitken
Date: Jun 9, 2008 04:53

On Mon, 9 Jun 2008 02:18:20 -0700 (PDT), George Knighton
gmail.com> wrote:
>On Jun 8, 6:13 pm, Ami...@webtv.net (David / Amicus) wrote:
>> Heraclius was the first to call himself Basileus.
>
He was the first to use it as an official title, but certainly not the
first to be called by it by the Greek-speaking population.
>That would only make sense, I suppose. In times before Rome, the
>Hellenes called the rulers of Persia Basileus. And I'm sure we're all
>aware of Heraclius's destruction of Persia.
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Re: Since when did Romans have "basileus"?         


Author: Crown-Horned Snorkack
Date: Jun 9, 2008 08:31

On 9 juuni, 00:14, David softhome.net> wrote:
> On Jun 8, 3:47 pm, Don Aitken freeuk.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>> On Sun, 8 Jun 2008 12:58:05 -0700 (PDT), Crown-Horned Snorkack
>
>> wrote:
>>>How did the ruler of Romans became "basileus"?
>
>>>At the time of Gaius Julius Caesar (Octavianus), in Latin he was
>>>Caesar, Imperator, Augustus (and Princeps as well).
>
>>>In Greek, Caesar was a name, thus transliterated as Kaisar. Imperator
>>>translates into Autokrator. Augustus translates as Sebastos.
>
>>>Gaius Julius Caesar very emphatically was not a Rex. Other figures,
>>>like Herodes king of Jews, the kings of Parthia, Armenia, Parthia et
>>>cetera were Rex in Latin and Basileus in Greek.
> ...
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Re: Since when did Romans have "basileus"?         


Author: David
Date: Jun 9, 2008 19:37

On Jun 9, 10:31 am, Crown-Horned Snorkack
wrote:
> On 9 juuni, 00:14, David softhome.net> wrote:
>
>> On Jun 8, 3:47 pm, Don Aitken freeuk.com> wrote:
>
>>> On Sun, 8 Jun 2008 12:58:05 -0700 (PDT), Crown-Horned Snorkack
>
>>> wrote:
>>>>How did the ruler of Romans became "basileus"?
>
>>>>At the time of Gaius Julius Caesar (Octavianus), in Latin he was
>>>>Caesar, Imperator, Augustus (and Princeps as well).
>
>>>>In Greek, Caesar was a name, thus transliterated as Kaisar. Imperator
>>>>translates into Autokrator. Augustus translates as Sebastos.
>
>>>>Gaius Julius Caesar very emphatically was not a Rex. Other figures,
>>>>like Herodes king of Jews, the kings of Parthia, Armenia, Parthia et
>>>>cetera were Rex in Latin and Basileus in Greek. ...
Show full article (2.64Kb)
22 Comments
Re: Since when did Romans have "basileus"?         


Author: David / Amicus
Date: Jun 9, 2008 20:45

< included Egypt, but also all the provinces along the Rhine, the Danube,
and the Persian frontier.>>

Regarding Egypt - wasn't it in a category all by itself as that it was
considered the personal property of the Emperor?

No person of Senatorial rank was permited to enter without special
permission.
no comments
Re: Since when did Romans have "basileus"?         


Author: David / Amicus
Date: Jun 9, 2008 20:49

In Imperial Roman rankings the title "Augustus" was superior to that of
"Caesar". The latter being the title of the heir.

Thus I wonder why some countries chose some form of "Caesar" as their
supreme ruler and not "Augustus"?

German - Kaiser

Russian - Tsar

++++++++++

Since the rulers of Orthodox Russia considered themselves to be the
heirs of Byzantium I wonder why none assumed the title of "Basileus"?
no comments

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