> "Dave Oldridge"
>
> wrote in message
> ...| "adman"
> <72545@hottmail.et > wrote in
>
>| bignews3.bellsouth.net>:
>
>|
>
>| >
>
>| > "Dave Oldridge"
> > wrote in message
>
>| > ...
>
>| >| Gabriel hotmail.com
> hotmail.com>> wrote in
>
>| >| 4ax.com>:
>
>| >|
>
>| >| > Every question you asked is answered by that verse, how death
>
>| >| > _passed_ upon all men, for that all have sinned.
>
>| >| >
>
>| >| > Where does it say that a man is born sinless, which completely
>
>| >| > implies that if they follow God's law they will remain sinless,
>
>| >| > and hence will not need Jesus Christ.
>
>| >| > Please show where in God's Word it says God's Law saves?
>
>| >| > Please show where in God's Word it says a person can get to
>
>| >| > heaven by works of the Law?
>
>| >| > Thank you.
>
>| >|
>
>| >| Where does it say that a child, or anyone else who has neither
>| >| known
>
>| >| of the law, nor violated it is condemned because of some ancestral
>
>| >| sin?
>
>| >|
>
>| >| It is you who is making this claim. It is an evil thing to impute
>
>| >| the sins of the fathers to their children, unless their children
>
>| >| actually take up the sins in question. And that is the real
>| >| problem
>
>| >| between us. You misinterpret the Bible so as to impute appalling
>| >| evil
>
>| >| to Almighty God. The atheists who come in contact with you are
>| >| very
>
>| >| quick to point this out. In effect, you have chosen evil and tried
>
>| >| to pass it off as good. By misreading Scripture and attributing to
>
>| >| Almighty God an evil that you seem enamored of, you have, in
>| >| effect,
>
>| >| created your own false god, which you place before the God
>| >| designated
>
>| >| by the tetragrammatom (YHVH), thus taking that name in vain.
>
>| >|
>
>| >| Of course, a real Bible scholar knows that Scripture is not a God
>| >| --
>
>| >| is not even infallible.
>
>| >|
>
>| >| Scripture is a collection of writings sanctified by tradition.
>| >| Those
>
>| >| writings form, not a single work by a single author, but a
>
>| >| progressive revelation of God. Nor did the revelation and with the
>
>| >| closing of the Canon in the fourth century. It goes on. So when
>
>| >| ancient Hebrew warriors attribute their personal atrocities to the
>
>| >| will of God, we need to be very careful about accepting such
>
>| >| attributions.
>
>| >|
>
>| >| Jesus Christ gave us, in the Golden rule, a very workable,
>
>| >| situational criterion for morality -- especially for it pertains
>| >| to
>
>| >| relating with other people. Applied correctly, the rule would
>
>| >| prevent a number of actions that, in the old testament, were
>
>| >| attributed to God's will.
>
>| >|
>
>| >| Examples would be the murder of the Midianites, the notion that a
>
>| >| rape victim should be compelled to marry the rapist, and other
>| >| such
>
>| >| nonsense.
>
>| >
>
>| > Everyone that died in Canna and the surrounding region at the hands
>| > of
>
>| > the Hebrew armies deserved death for the corruption they helped
>
>| > unleashed upon the earth. I regret King Og was not destroyed in the
>
>| > flood. Such deaths were ordered by YHVH. You know it, and i know
>
>| > it.Why represent it as anything else other then a deliberate
>| > attempt
>
>| > to trap souls.
>
>|
>
>| By those lights, your own death should be ordered, since your false
>| god
>
>| is claimed by you to have ordered the deaths of babies whose only sin
>
>| appears to have been being born to the wrong mothers and fathers.
>
>
>
> It was necessary. The few were lost to save the many because the whole
> earth had been filled with the blood of iniquity. Your ancestors
> begged Enoch to ask YHVH for forgiveness. You should do the same.
Your interpretation of Scripture makes you claim that it was necessary to
kill babies. You probably think it's still necessary to kill babies by
denying them the necessary medical treatment. Any god that requires such
human sacrifices is not YHVH, no matter how many times you lie and say it
is. In fact, the Bible gives us the name of this false god. It is
Moloch, the ancient king god of the Ammonites. They used to kidnap other
people's families and sacrifice them to their false god, until David and
his Philistine friend had their families kidnapped by them and went after
them and put an end to their abomination.
You see, your problem is that you impute perfection to the authors of
Scripture. They were human just like you. Some of them may have even
been a little worse than you, which is a very difficult thing to
accomplish. When the Israelites got angry with their relatives the
Midianites (Moses was married to the daughter of their high priest,
Jethro), they committed an atrocity. Being the winners, THEY wrote the
history of their atrocity and put the spin on it that God ordered them to
do it.
> .You forget Dave,YHVH did not start the war, your father and his
> followers did. Why do you defend such a rebellion? The blood of the
> souls lost are not on the hands of YHVH, but on the hands of those who
> were put in charge of creation and sought to destroy the creation.
> Look at the countless lives that had been destroyed over your father's
> petty jealousy.
Which the rebellion are you referring to? That of the Midianites against
the Israelites priest caste? Or that of your father in hell against my
father in heaven?
Is your father in hell, who sows discord among humans. Just as you are
trying to do with your lies about the science of evolution.
When you get a dose of honesty, come back and talk to me about my
authority. I think by that time it you will realize that it is real.
>| But this is the wages of biblical literalism. It is the price of
>| taking
>
>| as infallible what is written by sinners.
>
>|
>
>| In short, your propensity to lie and lie and lie is learned at the
>| feet
>
>| of your spiritual masters, who make their living lying about God,
>| using
>
>| the Bible as a pathetic excuse to do so.
>
>
>
> YHVH has been clear. False teachers will be the first to feel his
> wrath.
This should scare the literal scats out of you. Instead you prate about
it, ignorantly supposing that it applies to those who lie about instead
of to you as a liar.
>| > As far as your interpertation of scripture, lets just say you mix
>
>| > enough truth with your deceitfulness to make yourself appear right
>| > to
>
>| > some people.And some people, sadly, will perish due to lack of
>
>| > knowledge. But those that mislead God's children; as you do, it
>| > will
>
>| > be better for them to have a rock tied to their neck and thrown
>| > into
>
>| > the ocean.
>
>| >
>
>| > You cannot fool the chosen ones Dave. But you can tempt the
>| > children
>
>| > who's faith has fallen on rocky soil.
>
>|
>
>| You are not a chosen one, unless you mean chosen by Lucifer to teach
>| his
>
>| doctrines to deceive those chosen by God.
>
>
>
> The ones chosen by God cannot be deceived. It's really THAT simple
Then it's very clear that you are not chosen by God. After all,
SOMETHING has deceived you into believing that you serve God by telling
lies about evolutionary science and by taking His name in vain.
It really is that simple.
>
>|
>
>| There is no need to tempt you. The evil one has you completely at his
>
>| disposal. All he has to do is slightly scratch your ego and you will
>| do
>
>| or say anything foul thing that he desires.
>
>
>
> Don't you know there is still time? Come to light Dave. Before it's
> too late. Bearing a false witness against me will do you no good.
I see no light where you are. Just as swirling pool of darkness and lies
reaching out its tentacles of untruth to snare the souls of the unwary.
I do not bear false witness against you, and claiming that I am is a
false witness of yours. It will do you no good. Your false witness
already declares you separate from God's kingdom. You can go to halls
and churches, you can chant false prayers, but until you repent your
actual sins and ask God for help in overcoming the temptations that lead
you to them, you have no standing in His kingdom.
You bear true witness against yourself. I need do nothing but point out
the falsity of your claims about science, to demonstrate completely that
this is true. It is not my words, that will convict you on The Day of
Judgment. It is your own. Nor will you have any excuse, since I have
warned you repeatedly.
Do not take this in the wrong way. Find yourself a true priest of God--a
father in God--examine your conscience, and confess your sins to him.
Ask him to pray with you, the prayer of the repentant sinner. Ask him to
instruct you in the true Christian faith, and listen carefully to what he
says. When you fully understand what he is saying, then ask for and
receive conditional baptism (this is done in case there was some flaw in
whatever baptism you have already received). You will have then taken
the very first step to becoming a Christian. Following that, you will
need to continue to examine your conscience, confess your sins, pray for
deliverance from, and learn about the Christian faith (catechism). When
your father in God is satisfied that you both understand the faith and
are making an effort to live it, you will be ready for the next step.
You will be ready to start following the teachings of John chapter 6, and
become one of those -- of us -- who has eaten Christ's body and drank His
blood.
Of course, you would prefer to either sweep such important passages of
Scripture, under your spiritual rug, or interpret them privately to mean
something they do not.
Again, that is your prerogative. But your actions have consequences and
the consequence of of denying that God has done what He has done is the
same here as it is when you deny the facts of His creation for the
purpose of promoting your private interpretation of Genesis.
There is a profound mystery here, revealed by the Holy Spirit to the
author of the Gospel of John. But without the spiritual part of it --
the authorized blessing -- you have nothing but crackers and sour grapes.
>| > Just like your father tried to tempt our cornerstone in the
>| > wilderness
>
>| > for 40 days, your father's children keep those who's faith is on
>| > rocky
>
>| > soil from understanding God's will today by misleading them.
>
>|
>
>|
>
>| You misspoke. You meant "our father."
>
>
>
> He's your father --the father of all lies. Just as you lie now.
>
>|
>
>| As if you had any intention of obeying God's will! You repeatedly lie
>
>| and lie and lie, then when it's pointed out that your lies are
>
>| falsehoods, you excuse them by abusing God's Word. Show me the verses
>
>| that say you are to lie in God's name. And that if I don't give you
>| my
>
>| blessing, I am condemned.
>
>
>
> your condemnation stems from your willingness to support a rebellion
> that you cannot win. This eon will come to a conclusion just as the
No, son, my condemnation stems from the fact that you blatantly and
obviously and hypocritically continue to behave in a fashion opposite to
that which you profess to follow. It is not my words that condemn you.
It is your own lies.
> other eons concluded. But this is the last one where salvation can be
> obtained. Do you think YHVH is going to allow this rebellion forever?
I am completely certain that your rebellion will not continue forever.
At least not in this world, and certainly not in the kingdom of heaven.
> Once the final soul has been given opportunity to choose the seals
> will be opened and your destruction will be certain. Come to the right
> side Dave. Walkaway from the fallen ones and ask YHVH for forgiveness.
> He knows we all fall short and sin. Your true God YHVH awaits your
> reply.
YOU are a manifestly fallen one. That is to say, you come in here daily
and preach the devil's message. You don't preach it outright, but rather
subtly, after the nature of your father in hell. You tell lies about
science, thus bearing false witness against the honest scientists who
have actually done the work. Then you imply, to those you would see that
they must also tell these same lies in order to be saved. You preach
about salvation by grace, yet your example shows that you are trying to
achieve salvation by works. And not only that, they are works of sin and
evil.
Surely, you do not expect me to ignore these obvious facts. But perhaps,
in your subtlety, you expect ignorant people to be deceived by your lies.
I am not an ignorant person and therefore am not part of your target
audience. Worse for you, I am an actual priest of God, capable of my own
connection and inspiration, should that be necessary. My prayers work.
Yours are just empty words.
I have long ago given you ample instruction on how to cure your
particular spiritual malady. You have shown by your actions and by your
words that you would rather go to hell than go to heaven. That is your
choice and your prerogative. But do not think that you are fooling me
with your lies. The only victim is yourself.
>| You have been repeatedly challenged to do this and you have
>| repeatedly
>
>| failed to do so or even attempt it.
>
>
>
> What challenge is that Dave? There is no challenge you can put to the
> chosen ones. You know this. Why pretend. There's no real challenge you
> can put to the children whose faith is on rocky soil either. So, Why
> pretend you can make a challenge to them. Do you seek to deceive the
> weak to have company on the final day? Forget it, their salvation is
> insured by the SON. The only challenge you can really make is one to
> yourself as You fight on the wrong side. Azazyel, Samyaza and others
> are imprisoned. The only ones left are the bad seeds that escaped the
> first destruction such as you.
You seem to be a dabbler in the occult, and being about names of demons
that you obviously do not understand. I'm sure, if your perfidy is
really deliberate and you have actually sold your soul to Satan, that
your are possibly on a first name basis with imprisoned demands.
Know this: I am the exorcist. If you are hanging out with any loose
ones, beware. Should it become necessary, I will imprison them again,
with God's help. You can lie and deny, clutch at the hems of the robes
of your demon friends all you want. In the end, if the demon you clutch
to your soul is exorcised, you will be sent to prison with it. Do you
understand what I have said? Note I did not ask if you agreed with it,
but merely if you understood it. Because if you understand it, then the
consequences are on your head not mine.
>
>| This is why I am able to declare you officially, and obviously
>
>| excommunicate from the communion of saints by your own express
>| desire.
>
>
>
> You have no authority Dave. You know it, I know it, but the ones who
> stayed on rocky soil do not realize it yet. You have no power on this
> earth other than to deceive and in lie.
Whether you know it or not, my authority is real. Your denial will not
change this.
You are obviously besotted with the power of the lie, since you try to
use it continually. Your worship of the father of lies is clear with
every word you write. Do not try to deceive me, as it only deepens your
own self-deception.
>
>| >
>
>| > Your father is the father of all lies, and he was a murder from the
>
>| > beginning. He continues to murder souls and wreak havoc on creation
>| > to
>
>| > this day via his deception. But the good news is the weeds will be
>
>| > removed from this earth soon because God's kingdom is at hand with
>
>| > each breath you take. Judgment, and a final rendering of your
>| > accounts
>
>| > before YHVH is all of creations destiny. You cannot run from it,
>| > you
>
>| > cannot hide from it, you cannot say it will not happen. Why not
>| > repent
>
>| > while there is still time? By the same forgiveness you offer, such
>
>| > mercy will be given to you.
>
>|
>
>| I am a sinner. I do examine my life on a regular basis and try to
>| repent
>
>| those since. However, you are a blasphemer -- a sinner who imputes
>| his
>
>| own sin to Almighty God. You're not just condemned to hell, you're on
>
>| the staff. May you and your father, the father of all your lies have
>| a
>
>| nice eternity together. Telling you to go to hell would be totally
>
>| redundant.
>
>
>
> YHVH is waiting for your answer. Your time is short.
YHVH is a word you do not understand and a name you use in vain. You
have no standing with El Shaddai, since you refuse to repent your sins.
>| > Your redemption or destruction draws closer as the generation of
>| > the
>
>| > fig tree comes to an end and a new eon begins. It is time for that
>
>| > choice Dave. Do not wait for the seals to be broken. It will be too
>
>| > late then.
>
>| >
>
>| > It is really THAT simple.
>
>|
>
>| It seems you have already made your choice. I gave it to you and you
>
>| responded with more lies and blasphemy. Therefore, I give you my
>
>| blessing: may you and the father of lies enjoy your eternity together
>| in
>
>| whatever way you can manage, separate from the communion of saints.
>
>|
>
>| There is nothing more to be said to you. You're thrown in your lot
>| with
>
>| the forces of Hell. That's your decision and you will have to live
>| and
>
>| die with it.
>
>
>
> There's plenty more say Dave. Stop running. You cannot hide.
I'm not running. You are.
>
>|
>
>| Sometimes, God wants to get the attention of someone as obdurate as
>| you.
>
>| When that happens, He usually has to yell louder than your threshold
>| of
>
>| pain. You need to start listening. Because what you are listening to
>
>| now is a distorted, hateful, reification of metaphors found in
>| ancient
>
>| scriptures that you neither understand nor follow.
>
>
>
> You are the prodigal son Dave. but your pain can end. YHVH is waiting
> with open arms even though you spent all the money. It's time to come
> home. All the Angels will rejoice in your right decision. Be the lost
> coin found, and the field that needs to the purchased.
Wrong metaphor. You, on the other hand, are not even the prodigal son.
You are the wolf in sheep's clothing, seeking to steal away members of
the flock. God, Angels, I know. But YOU are just a pathetic human,
seduced by delusions of power into a career of lying for the evil one.
You have been warned. If it is your choice to ignore the warnings, and
the consequences of your choice are on your head.
It's rather sad that your false preachers and phony prophets can load you
up with so many lies that you actually believe that repeating them over
and over again in the face of evidence to the contrary will make you a
better person and make God love you more.
God does love you, despite the fact that nobody else can think why. But
He does not love your sins and they cannot remain in His presence. If
you wish to retain them, as you quite evidently do, then you can never
remain in his presence. It really is that simple.
Come out of Babylon. It is not yet too late.
Am I getting through? Or is it time for a little ritual sandal scraping?
--
Dave Oldridge+
ICQ 1800667
