Scenario.
Type 2 diabetes with diagnosed lung cancer.
June of last year requested brother to find a .. "killpill" .. in
order to end this .. mortal coil.
This was BEFORE lung cancer was diagnosed .. just diabetes and lung
function problem / oxygen.
NOW seven months later in a end of life daycare centre his 'decision'
of refusal of .. intervention .. is being adhered to .. completely.
He cannot or willnot take food and refuses IV nutrition.
Now the fact he asked for a killpill BEFORE the diagnoses of cancer
would lead one to believe there is a question of DEPRESSION .. in
the .. scenario .. ?
The fact they would let a depressed person starve to death is .. in my
mind .. unacceptable.

Is this the take of just .. me .. ?

If the cancer .. kills him .. fine.

But .. starvation .. ?

Who loves ya.
Tom

[full disclosure: an old friend recently chose to draw life to a close -
she had a rare and untreatable condition that caused her entiree
intestinal tract to undergo systemic change and tissue overgrowth that
was slowly shutting down all ability to eat, drink, or absorb nutrition.

her life might have been sustained for another year or two had she
elected to have a series of gastric tube implants - but they would have
failed one after another as the tissue changes advanced

she decided that to undergo such, and only gain another year or so was
not any way to live - and went into hospice care instead. after
withdrawing any form of tube nutrition, she passed quitely in her sleep
last week; at home, with her family - as she wished.

all of us in the circle that she called 'friend' had private moments
during those few weeks before she passed - talking and laughing with her
about - oh, just anything. there was no pain, nor sorrow -

in her view, she was about to embark upon the greatest adventure
unknowable to any of us in advance -
what lies ahead after we die?]

as to the post:

Paul, I'm so sorry about the loss of your friend. I believe she made her
decisions with knowledge of prognosis and decided she did not want to suffer
needlessly for what would come in the end, anyway. I hope I am able to do
the same when my time comes.

Everyone has their own personal beliefs and that is all we can go by. It's
personal, and actually nobody else's right to interfere with.

René

"Paul T. Holland" bellatlantic.net> wrote in message
news:47C71150.3BF00AD8@bellatlantic.net...

Dear Paul,

Sorry to hear about your friend, but she did the right way, with dignity and
surrounded by friends and love, while she could appreciate it. Dying of
cancer pain, raging throughout your body, then planting it under a marker
that says "Rest in Peace" is the ultimate in hypocrisy, when one could go
out like your friend and "Remain in Peace." The last gift your friend left
you was a piece of herself in good spirits and camaraderie and love. It's
going to take a while to fill up that empty spot from that piece of you she
took along with her. But her gift will grow to fill that spot.

Sorry again for your loss--og

--
Be Sure to Check Out the PAYNE HERTZ blog, for people with chronic pain, by
people with chronic pain.
join in at: http://paynehertz.blogspot.com

"Paul T. Holland" bellatlantic.net> wrote in message
news:47C71150.3BF00AD8@bellatlantic.net...

Paul, sorry to hear this but she went the way you know is right by her and
my own wishes. She truly is at peace and rested.
Let's hope it's not someone I lost contact with recently. Please email me.

CB
"Paul T. Holland" bellatlantic.net> wrote in message
news:47C71150.3BF00AD8@bellatlantic.net...

Paul, thanks for sharing this. It affected me personally. My mother is in
a terminal situation, age 86, right now, but she isn't cognitive and so my
DH and I had to make that decision FOR her. 2 options: aggressive
treatment for her, with no guaranteed results, or Hospice. I knew Mom
wouldn't have wanted to prolong life just for a little more time here, so we
chose Hospice. Nanny
"Ren

I seem to be getting a message today about my recent decision to place Mom
under Hospice care instead of exposing her to aggressive treatments. First,
it was finding a movie on TV today where a cancer patient doesn't want chemo
& radiation, because he wanted *quality" life instead of more time. Then,
on the Tender group, the subject was brought up. Finally, I check in here,
and a couple more people are discussing this subject when facing a major
health crisis. Perhaps all these things combined were meant to reassure me
not to feel guilty about the decision to place my Mom in Hospice care. She
is 86 and has serious Dementia and major health issues. Glad you told us
about your friend, Paul. Nanny
"OldGoat" ERdocsuckYahoo.com> wrote in message
news:p_Kxj.9305$Dz4.470@trnddc01...

On Feb 28, 11:51 am, "Paul T. Holland" bellatlantic.net>
wrote:an old friend <<

The guy is 64 years old .. long ways from being .. old.

Using Jack Lalane.. as a .. marker ..

Who loves ya.
Tom

Jesus Was A Vegetarian!
http://jesuswasavegetarian.7h.com

Man Is A Herbivore!
http://tinyurl.com/a3cc3

DEAD PEOPLE WALKING
http://tinyurl.com/zk9fk

On Thu, 28 Feb 2008 19:51:34 +0000, Paul T. Holland wrote:

On Feb 29, 7:11 am, Top neo.rr.com> wrote: As for who decides
when enough is enough
I'm not sure I'm qualified to answer that. I've seen people suffer
much more than anyone should knowing
all they had left was death and I'm sure we all have. If we start
tinkering with when and how they should go (exclude those eligible to
have the plug pulled) then would we involve doctors and lawyers? <<

I'm saying .. based on the EVIDENCE.

Person upon questioning / family talk mentions this .. "killpill" ..
DURING discussions regarding his life ..

MENTIONS he had requested someone find him a "killpill" ..

THEN seven months later this killpill discussion is mentioned.

THEREFORE .. leaving one to BELIEVE there is more to this ..
decision .. THAN simply .. wish for death due to incurable
illness .. ?

Just because doctors can't find their asses with their collective
hands doesn't MEAN .. everyone cannot.

JUST because of that .. alone ..