>Kirk: "We find the one [god] quite sufficient". (Or something like that, I
>may be paraphrasing). Was he speaking for Spock, and other non-terran crew
>members as well? ;o)

> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006 11:24:03 -0000, "Jaxtraw"
> knickersjaxtrawstudios.com> wrote:
>

>> Kirk: "We find the one [god] quite sufficient". (Or something like that, I
>> may be paraphrasing). Was he speaking for Spock, and other non-terran crew
>> members as well? ;o)

>
> Irrelevant. He was speaking *to* the standards and practices division of
> the network, and the FCC, as well as to a general public more likely than
> today's to take offense at the line "We have no need of gods .. "

> "ToolPackinMama" lauragoodwin.org> wrote...

>> IMHO, that is the defining moment. That pretty much summed up Kirk's
>> entire attitude about the idea of living in service to some/any God.

>
> OTOH, I wonder what would have happened if Apollo had merely
> pronounced his new Olympus open to all and sent Kirk and the
> Enterprise off with an invitation to all who wanted to come.
> By the 24th century most people on Earth are happily munching
> replicated food and spending their time "bettering themselves,"
> to the point that people like Picard are in such a hurry to flee
> that they don't even bother to dump their girlfriends face to face.
> I bet there would have been takers.

> ToolPackinMama wrote:

>> Apollo proposed a happy, simple way of life that Kirk TOTALLY
>> REJECTED.

>
> Kirk was wise enough to reject it for three perfectly good reasons-
>
> 1) He believes (as all sensible people do) that human dignity is based on
> personal freedom. Even a comfortable existence as the creature of even a
> benign faux-god is completely anathema to Kirk.
>
> 2) There's nothing happy and simple about low-tech farming. It's endless
> drudgery and labour. Agricultural romanticism is an affliction of modern
> city dwellers, who, far removed from the reality, fantasise a pastoral
> idyll. No way in space would Kirk (on behalf of all his crew) give up a life
> of food replicators, transporters, air conditioning, warp drive etc etc for
> shovelling goat shit.
>
> (Indeed, Kirk's rejection of the proposed back-to-nature pastoral idyll is a
> good warning to those today who romanticise such a life and hate the ...

> ToolPackinMama wrote:

>> GeneK wrote:

>>> "ToolPackinMama" lauragoodwin.org> wrote...

>>>> We actually have no reason to believe that Jim Kirk is himself
>>>> religious in any way.

>>> I think that Kirk's statement in "Bread and Circuses" is
>>> meant to convey to Apollo that humanity in general no
>>> longer has any need to believe in multiple deities living
>>> on mountains and not necessarily his own personal
>>> beliefs. There is nothing to tell us one way or the other
>>> whether Kirk believes there is a god, is not a god, or
>>> that there just might be a god. It is fairly evident though,
>>> that if he believes there is a god he isn't expecting that
>>> god to do anything for him personally.

>> Exactly. Kirk himself never relies on any God.

>
> However, according at least to STV TFF, he at least is aware of the proposed
> existence of one, and it seems to be the traditional Judaeo-Christian one
> (old man with beard) so that implies that Kirk favours the Judaeo-Christian ...

> Jesus was born

> realize that YOU PERSONALLY didn't invent any of your own philosophy.

> Steven L. wrote:
>

>> Jesus was born

>
> Was he?
>
> Some skeptics declare there is no good evidence to show that he actually
> existed.