> On Dec 30, 2:56 pm, cactus
nonespam.com> wrote:>>> On Dec 30, 12:40 am, cactus
nonespam.com> wrote:>>>> Terry Cross wrote:
>>>>>> On 20-Dec-2007, cactus
nonespam.com> wrote:>>>>>>>> I repeat: The Khazars are the people who lived in western Russia and
>>>>>>>> converted en masse to Judaism in about 600 AD. They are the blood
>>>>>>>> ancestors of most of the Ashkenazi Jews in Europe.
>>>>>>> And I repeat the question that you dishonestly snipped from the earlier
>>>>>>> post: > What do Khazars have anything to do with this?
>>>>>> Why do you expect her to answer honestly when she has only repeated her lie,
>>>>>> above?
>>>>>> Susan
>>>>> I did not introduce the subject of Khazars; I explained it. When you
>>>>> speak of Jews, you speak of Khazars.
>>>> Jews come from all over. Khazars are one group that converted en masse.
>>>> It is wrong to believe that is where all the Ashkenazim originated
>>>> because the Khazars did not magically move into Europe after their
>>>> conversion.
>>>> Stupid.
>>>> The real descendants of the
>>>>> Hebrews are the natives of the Middle east - Palestinians, Samaritans,
>>>>> Lebanese, Jordanians, and the rest.
>>>> People can become Jewish by conversion as well, and they have. What do
>>>> Hebrews have to do with this? This is just adding another meaningless
>>>> term to your word salad.-
>>> The mistreatment of Jews in Arab lands was universal. From the
>>> beginning of Islam in 622 C.E. Islam preached an anti-Jewish gospel.
>>> In 627 Mohammed's followers killed 900 Jews in Arabia for the "sin" of
>>> refusing conversion to the new religion. The Koran, the Scripture of
>>> the Moslems, includes these verses: (Sura 2:61) "They (the Jews) are
>>> consigned to humiliation and wretchedness. They brought the wrath of
>>> God upon themselves etc." In Sura 5:64 "the Jews" are accused of
>>> corruption, in 5:76 "the Jews" are disobedient and in 21:9798 the Jews
>>> are the enemies of Allah and the angels. Jews, throughout Moslem
>>> history, had to pay a special tax. Jews were forbidden, on pain of
>>> death, to criticize the Koran. This applied to Christians as well.
>>> Jews were forbidden to touch a Moslem woman although Moslem men are
>>> allowed to deal with Jewish women. Jews were always excluded from
>>> public office, were not allowed to ride horses or camels, could not
>>> build a synagogue higher than a mosque, nor drink wine in public. Jews
>>> were not allowed to pray, except at home, and Jews had to get off the
>>> sidewalk if a Moslem passed by. A Jew could not testify in a Moslem
>>> court. In addition, Jews and Christians had to wear distinctive
>>> clothes including a yellow badge, an idea which was adopted by the
>>> Nazi brutes in the 1940's.
>>> Sudden persecutions, violence and murder were constant events in the
>>> lives of the Jewish communities in Moslem lands. For example, in 1066
>>> Arab mobs murdered Joseph HaNagid, the most prominent member of the
>>> Granada Jewish community and then slaughtered all 5,000 Jews in that
>>> city. In 1465 Arab mobs attacked the Jews of Fez in Morocco, killing
>>> thousands. In the 12th century similar murders of Jews took place in
>>> North Africa and as late as 1785 hundreds of Jews were murdered in
>>> Libya. In 1805, 1830 and 1880 massacres of Jews occurred in Marrakesh.
>>> Synagogues were burnt in Egypt, Syria, Iraq, and Yemen for centuries.
>>> Repeatedly Jews were forced to convert to Islam or face death. The
>>> Jews in all Arab countries lived in ghettos (from get, a Hebrew word
>>> for divorce or separation). Jews in Morocco were forced to walk
>>> barefoot as Moslem children were encouraged to throw stones at Jews on
>>> the street. In the Ottoman Empire "ritual murder" was attributed to
>>> Jews every year at Pesach. These horrors continued until the Jews of
>>> Israel made themselves independent despite the United Nations and the
>>> Arab haters.
>>> Therefore, do not fall for the propaganda that the trouble between
>>> Jews and Arabs was caused by the establishment of Israel. Exactly
>>> the opposite. If Israel did not exist, the Jews in Arab lands would
>>> still be in the ghetto, still the butt of Moslem hatred.
>>> In sum, we learn here that the Exodus from Arab lands was as much a
>>> liberation from slavery as the first Exodus. Let us, after the recent
>>> Pesach season, keep that in mind and stand up for the rights of the
>>> Jews from Egypt and Jordan, from Iraq and Yemen, from Syria and Iran
>>> from all those places who have not yet learned the lesson of Leviticus
>>> 19:18 (Look it up).
>>> Shalom u'vracha.
>>>
http://jbuff.com/c042503.htm
>>> Jim
>>> Isa 35:10 -And the ransomed of the LORD shall return, and come to Zion
>>> with songs and everlasting joy upon their heads: they shall obtain joy
>>> and gladness, and sorrow and sighing shall flee away.
>> Interesting, thank you. But Jews and Muslims did get along well in Spain
>> for centuries, and many Jews fled to Turkey after the Iberian Peninsula
>> was dragged into darkness by Ferdinand and Isabella.-
>
>
>
> Miss Armstrong can look after herself in her row with the critic of
> Islam, Robert Spencer.
>
> But I must say I was annoyed by another claim she made in her review
> of Spencer's book. This is something one hears all the time. "In
> Muslim Spain," she wrote, "relations between the three religions of
> Abraham were uniquely harmonious in medieval Europe."
>
> This is simply not true. The centuries between the Muslim invasion of
> Spain in 711 and the reconquest of their last enclave in 1492 were
> characterised by warfare, double-dealing, opportunist alliances,
> expropriation, punitive taxation and persecution.
>
> The nearest that Islamic Spain got to a peace-loving polity was the
> Caliphate of Cordoba, which existed between 929 and 1031, just over
> 100 years out of more than 700 years of occupation.
>
> Its political status rested on dubious ground, for its founder claimed
> to be Caliph of the whole world from his stronghold in Spain, when
> there was already a Caliph in Baghdad. The Fatimids in North Africa
> also claimed the Caliphate in rivalry to Cordoba.
>
> The mosque at Cordoba, that great beauty of world architecture, was
> built on the site of the church of St Vincent, demolished to make way
> for it. In the early years after the Muslim invasion, Christians had
> been allowed to worship in part of the cathedral site, all their other
> churches having been demolished at the conquest. But under the
> Ummayyads, the founders of the Caliphate of Cordoba, the Christians
> had to relinquish their part of St Vincent's.
>
> Under the Caliphate of Cordoba, it was not just the Christians of
> northern Spain who fought to gain territory. The 10th-century de facto
> ruler of the caliphate, al-Mansur, fought expansionist wars, sacking
> Barcelona in 985 and Santiago in 997. He had already defeated his
> father-in-law in battle, with Muslims and Christians fighting on both
> sides. That is unique harmony of a sort.
>
> After the collapse of the Caliphate in civil war, things got no
> better. There is a statue in Cordoba to Moses Maimonides, the great
> Jewish philosopher. But Maimonides and his family had to flee Spain to
> escape persecution by the ruling Muslim dynasty.
>
> The 12th-century Muslim thinker, Ibn-Rushd, known as Averroes to
> Christian philosophers, who took him very seriously, was also banished
> from the Spanish peninsula by the intolerant Almohad rulers.
>
> I suppose if you had to choose which Muslim regime to live under in
> the Middle Ages, the Caliphate of Cordoba would be a good choice, but
> let's not pretend it was a secular liberal state.
>
>
> Posted by Christopher Howse on 30 Apr 2007 at 15:05
>
>
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/ukcorrespondents/christopherhowse/apr2007/themuslimruleofspain...
>
> Jim
>
Interesting, thank you. Happy New Year.
