>> I don't believe in evil, I believe there is evil, distinction there.

>
> Could it not be so 'evil' that you could get caught up in it without
> even knowing?
> Think of the 'boy soldiers' of Africa. Taught to indiscriminately
> machine gun families.
>

>> Jesus talked about the Devil so I believe there is an Evil One.
>> Jesus
>> also instructs us to pray for a change of heart in our enemies, so
>> should we pray for a change of heart in the Devil?  He actually
>> doesn't have a heart, he's just a spirit with no body.

>
> Ahhhh, I see. Spirit , as you describe, is...hang on, I dont see. What
> do you mean?
>

>> I've met many
>> Christians who insist it's wrong to pray for a change of heart in the
>> Devil and that puzzles me.  It's a dilemna.  The Saints are almost
>> always portrayed in movies as emphasizing the forgiveness aspect of
>> Christianity.  In a movie about Saint Francis, "Brother Sun, Sister
>> Moon" the Pope tells him to believe in original innocence and not
>> original sin.

>
> So how long does one go by what others tell them. At what age does
> spiritual maturity come about.
>
> Heaven and hell with the accompanying archytypes, are simply depicting
> duel aspects of our individual nature. We 'evolve' spiritually, by our
> own actions.I used to wonder why the principle of reaping and sowing
> was so difficult for a Christian to recognise, but then I realized ,
> thats where they needed to be to learn. Karma is the same obstacle for
> all "undergraduates" to realize, from all cultures.
>
> A child needs to have the fear of the negative depicted, until he is
> old enough to develop his own power of discrimination.
>

>>Yet many theologians and Christians believe Jesus is
>> the Redeemer (some also believe Mary is Coredemptrix) and that
>> wihthout His redeeming love and grace we would all be doomed.

>
> Except the many millions of jungle dwelers, to say nothing about those
> that pre dated 'the redeemer'.
>

>> It is
>> the biblical belief that we have original sin.

>
> This is the language of the dogmatist. Correction. Many make such
> interpretation. The power of the churches rely on that interpretation,
> so they can sell you the solution.
>

>> In  the Middle Ages,
>> the Catholic culture was such that most believed there was a Hell and
>> quite a few believed they were going there, but they also believed or
>> knew there was a God and a Heaven.

>
> Precisely, and gave a good portion of their produce for the privaledge
> of being told of the solution, after being told of the problem.. Some
> things do not change!
>

>> Nowadays many people doubt there
>> is a God, even to the point of Atheism, but they are not afriad of
>> burning in Hell because they seriously doubt there is an Inferno.

>
> Hard to live a life of fear, and accept many dont. They must have
> 'inferior beliefs".
>
> On the spiritual scale , atheism is more advanced than religiosity.
>

>>It
>> seems that because so many people doubt there is really a Hell they
>> are more likely to sin and less likely to be held accountable for
>> their actions.

>
> I dont often swear, but what fucking arrogance.Such people are more
> likely to hold themselves responsible for their actions, and not rely
> on some priestfor 'absolution' (until my next confession).
>

>> If a priest delivers a sermon about Hell you always
>> have the danger of the good parishoners fearing they will go there and
>> the more evil listeners brushing the Hell theory off as though it were
>> nonsense.

>
> If they are listening, they are still working on their own self
> realization.
>

>> I've seen that it is very difficult to deliver a sermon that
>> all will understand unless you talk in tongues of fire like the Holy
>> Ghost at Pentecost.

>
> And its all become much clearer since then !!!!. The best way to evoke
> fear , is to present people with levels of reality that they are just
> not equipped to handle.
>

>> It's astounding that someone like LeFevre was
>> excommunicated from the Catholic Church (id est Hell?) because he
>> supported the Latin Tridentine Mass and yet someone like Ted Kennedy
>> or John Kerry can still receive Holy Communion. The politics and
>> communication of the Church are kind of a mess these days.

>
> Sounds like you are starting to evolve, spiritually.
>
> BOfL
>
>
>
>
>

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