> "Jerry Kraus" yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:8e085a30-add6-40f9-be5b-b49a4abb8c05@d45g2000hsc.googlegroups.com...
> On May 14, 11:15 am, tg earthlink.net> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>

>> On May 14, 11:34 am, Jerry Kraus yahoo.com> wrote:

>

>>> On May 14, 10:28 am, lorad...@cs.com wrote:

>

>>>> On May 14, 8:13 am, Jerry Kraus yahoo.com> wrote:

>

>>>>> You will find it instructive to listen to a radio play based on the
>>>>> work of Russian writer/prostitute Maria Sudaieva, who committed
>>>>> suicide in order to escape exploitation by the Russian Mafia, on
>>>>> Radio
>>>>> France Culture:

>

>>>>>http://www.radiofrance.fr/chaines/france-culture2/emissions/theatre_e...

>

>>>>> If you are wondering why contemporary Russia is facing a demographic
>>>>> crisis of a rapidly declining population, and why life expectancy
>>>>> has
>>>>> declined by 10%% in the country since the fall of Communism, this may
>>>>> help to explain why. There is no government. Just Capitalist
>>>>> exploitation by the rich and powerful, using violence, drugs,
>>>>> intimidation, sex as control strategies.

>

>>>>> What was Maria Sudaieva's perception of the Communists? They were
>>>>> the
>>>>> "Red Heroes": Saints, Gods, Angels. They protected the poor against
>>>>> the rich. Yes, they were controlling: but, for Good, not Evil.

>

>>>> Do you have a little shrine in your place.. with candles beneath the
>>>> larger than life painting of Lenin.. or something?
>>>> Maybe with little red stars all around?

>

>>>> Anyways.. 'capitalism' doesn't exist in russia.
>>>> The country is run by 'ex'-KGB who staff over 60%% of all high and
>>>> middle level govement offices.

>

>>>> Communist politicians used to be 'the rich' in russia.
>>>> Now ex-communist KGB are 'the rich' in russia.

>

>>>> Trying to claim that pootey-poot is a capitalist is crazy.
>>>> Just go ask BP how they lost their multi-billions of investment money.

>

>>>> Russia sucks and so do you.- Hide quoted text -

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>>>> - Show quoted text -

>

>>> Who says ex-KGB can't be Capitalist? You don't think the Mafia are
>>> Capitalists, Russian or otherwise? Everyone else does.

>

>>> What do you think Capitalism is, anyway? Truth, Justice and the
>>> American Way? It's just money. Making money. Any way you can.
>>> Capitalism is just Greed based social behavior. This is your ideal?

>

>> The thing about Russia is, they once had a feudal society tightly
>> controlled by secret police and a network of local 'bosses' who
>> exploited the labor of the serfs. Then, they had a feudal society
>> incorrectly called 'communism' which was tightly controlled by secret
>> police and a network of local 'bosses' who exploited the labor of the
>> proletariat. But that passed away, and now they have a feudal society
>> called 'capitalism' tightly controlled by secret police and.......

>

>> -tg- Hide quoted text -

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>> - Show quoted text -

>
> True.  But the Soviet Union did have a better system of centralized
> control and oversight for the country as a whole than is currently the
> case.  People were controlled, but they lived longer, and were more
> secure materially than is the case now.
>
> ==============================================
> Rubbish. Complete and utter rubbish.
>
> The Soviet regime published statistics about how things were better under
> "socialism" but those were largely lies. When Stalin collectivized
> agriculture in the late 1920s, he precipitated a man-made famine that cost 5
> to 9 million lives, depending on which historian's numbers you accept. Life
> expectancy in some areas was as little as 11 years, which was far worse than
> under even the most repressive of the Tsars. Naturally, the Soviet regime's
> prestige would have suffered internationally if they published those numbers
> so they simply lied about the actual life expectancy.
>
> The Soviets made much of how their new freer society was far better than
> life under the Tsars. Yet under the most vicious and repressive of the
> Tsars, the actual number of people executed by the Tsars minions was 300 per
> year. At the height of Stalin's purges, that many were perishing in a single
> HOUR.
>
> As for being more secure materially, one of the constants in the lives of
> Soviet citizens as late as the early Gorbachev era were the endless queues.
> What few material goods were available were purchased by standing in line.
> The lines were very very long. It typically took several hours of standing
> in line to get to the front of that queue; 8 hour waits were not unusual for
> items like bread. Soviet citizens were so desperately short of mateial goods
> that they would habitually get in any queue that they saw without even
> knowing what it was or whether they wanted what was being sold. They didn't
> really care: material goods were so scarce that _everything_ was valuable.
> If it turned out that the item was not something they personally wanted,
> they bought it anyway and used it to barter for something they wanted more.
> Larger items took even more patience than bread or boots. It took 10 _years_
> to get a car.
>
> Ask anyone who lived in the Soviet Union and they will tell you that a
> certain Russian saying epitomized life in those times: "we pretend to work,
> they pretend to pay us".  This wasn't just a witty remark, it was the way of
> life for anyone who wasn't in the 'nomenklatura' (the inner ranks of the
> Communist party and the technocrats they relied on to manage things). The
> top dogs lived decent lives and had special clothing, special rations,
> special accomodations and private hospitals; everyone else lived in
> deplorable conditions.
>
> If that's the kind of life you want for yourself and your family, you're
> welcome to it. Go find somewhere that will let you live like that - North
> Korea comes to mind - but don't expect me to embrace it.
>
> --
> Rhino- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -