> On May 13, 11:54 am, Jerry Kraus yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>

>> On May 13, 1:50 pm, FACE today.net> wrote:

>

>>> From  Jerry Kraus yahoo.com>,
>>>  on Tue, 13 May 2008 11:41:32 -0700 (PDT)

>

>>>>On May 13, 1:38 pm, "simple_langu...@yahoo.com"
>>>>yahoo.com> wrote:

>>>>> Left wing fascists hate free speech:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iNEIprfXXqU

>

>>>>Oh, not at all.  Mr.  Goldberg is welcome to babble all he wishes.
>>>>Helps to prove the point that he's talking nonsense.

>

>>>>Mind you, we're not all that thrilled with corporate control over the
>>>>media.  Because we believe in free speech.

>

>>>>I can see why fascists like yourself have to try to confuse the
>>>>meaning of the word, by the way.  That's pretty obvious.

>

>>> "We are socialists, we are enemies of today's capitalistic economic
>>>  system for the exploitation of the economically weak, with its unfair
>>>  salaries, with its unseemly evaluation of a human being according to
>>>  wealth and property instead of responsibility and performance, and we
>>>  are all determined to destroy this system under all conditions."

>

>>>  John Toland, qouting a speech by Adolf Hitler , in his 1976 biography
>>>  "Adolf Hitler" (pg. 306)

>

>> Curious, that Hitler killed so many socialists and communists, and was
>> ultimately beaten by them.

>
> No, Naziism was beaten not by socialists or communists, but by the
> Russian
> people, the British armed forces and the US armed forces.  Socialists
> and
> communists chose to back Hitler and oppose Western efforts to fight
> Naziism
> when they had the freedom to chose.  Later, when their policies
> brought the
> world to the brink, acting out of selfish self-preservation, they
> chose to
> let others fight for them, and force others to fight for them.
>
> Let's have a look at some examples:
>
> (i) Liberal opinion opposes standing up to Naziism.

>
>  Archibald Sinclair delivered
> a long speech in parliament on "the question of private profits being
> made
> out of the means of death" and expressed astonishment at Churchill's
> "dangerous argument" that vast sums should be spent on the RAF "in
> view of
> the financial conditions of this country and the intolerable burdens
> of
> our national debt and taxation."
>
> (ii) socialist opinion tries to ensure Britain is defenceless before
> Nazi aggression
>
> In 1935, the White Paper issued by HMG
> on 4th March announced plans to expedite air force increases and
> proposed
> a major additional defense application.  Churchill was elated, Hitler
> was
> furious, the Labour MPs, led by Atlee, moved to censure, but were
> roundly
> defeated, and an air estimates debate scheduled for Tuesday 19th
> March.
> Page 134, "Shoals", "The Last Lion: Alone" William Manchester.
>
> In this debate, Churchill attacked the govt, calling for RAF expansion
> to be
> doubled.  "Atlee's Labourites were furious", writes Manchester.   In
> March,
> Hitler himself had told Sir John Simon and Anthony Eden that the
> Luftwaffe
> had gained parity.  But german intelligence had overestimated the
> number of
> aircraft we had by more than 200%%.  They were far ahead of us, yet
> this same
> Atlee was "furious" at efforts to rearm. [Page 136, ibid]
>
> William Manchester writes: "Even as Labour and Liberal pacifists were
>
> fuming that Baldwin, prodded by the warmonger Churchill, was
> returning
> England to its militant imperial past, genuine militarism was forming
> in
> ranks on a riverbank 375 miles to the East."  Germany was marching
> into
> the Rhineland.  Here we have evidence of Labourite sabotage of our
> rearmament effort, made at the same time as the invasion of the
> Rhineland.  AFTER this, Lloyd-George stated that the invasion was
> made
> after provocation of the Narzis (presumably we hadn't disarmed fast
> enough)
> and socialist peer Lord Snowden said the Nazis were "only going into
> their
> back yard."
>
> (iii) socialist and liberal opinion, thwarted in their efforts to
> prevent Britain
> from re-arming, tries to prevent HMG raising an army to fight Naziism.
>
> Churchill records that: "In the debate the Opposition failed in their
> duty.  Both Labour and Liberal parties shrank from facing the ancient
> and deep rooted prejudice which has always existed in England against
> compulsory military service, and their leaders found reasons for
> opposing this step.
> Both these men were distressed at the course they felt bound on party
> grounds to take.  But they both took it, and adduced a wealth of
> reasons.
> The division was on party lines, and the Conservative Party carried
> their policy by 380 to 143 votes.  In my speech I tried my best to
> persuade the Opposition to support this indispensible measure; but
> my efforts were in vain."
>
> All that waffle means Liberal and Labour MPs voted *against*
> conscription on the eve of the war.
>
> (iii) Communists make a pact with Hitler
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molotov-Ribbentrop_Pact
>
> (iv) Communists help the Nazis subdue Poland
>
> ARMAGEDDON by Clive Ponting, ISBN 0-679-43602-2, page 225:
>
> "The country that suffered the most under occupation was Poland.
> After
> it was partitioned in September 1939, there is no doubt that
> conditions
> in the Soviet area were far worse than in the west under German rule.
> By 1941 the Soviets had killed about four times as many Poles as the
> Germans (about 480,00 compared with 120,000) and this from a
> population
> about half the size of that controlled by Germany.  Three separate
> Soviet mass deportations removed over 1 million Poles, mainly from
> the
> intellectual and political elite, and overall about 10%% of all adult
> males in the Soviet controlled territories were imprisoned and
> tortured.
> At Boryslaw people were killed by having their mouths sewn together
> by
> barbed wire, or their eyes gouged out, or by being pushed into
> boiling
> water."
>
> "When the Germans invaded in June 1941 all prisoners were either
> killed
> or deported by the Soviets; at Lvov prison 12,400 were killed out of
> a
> total of 13,000 inmates."
>
> (v) Communists help U-Boats sink British shipping
>
> "Germam naval forces were able to use Murmansk
> as a base.  In return, the Soviets received metal
> and electrical products, together with military
> equipment"
> page 37, ARMAGEDDON by Clive Ponting, ISBN 0-679-43602-2
> ==
> "During April his deliveries of raw materials to Germany reached
> their
> highest since the signing of the Nazi-Soviet in August 1939: 208,000
> tons of grain, 90,000 tons of fuel oil, 8,300 tons of cotton, 6,340
> tons of copper, tin, nickel, and other metals, and 4,000 tons of
> rubber."
> The Second World War, John Keegan, ISBN 0-14-011341-X
>
> (vi) Communists help sabotage Western resistance to Naziism
>
> "During the 1939 to 1941 period, attacks on the British were
> encouraged, but
> no mention even of the word 'fascism' was allowed."
>
> The Great Terror  A Reassessment, Robert Conquest ISBN 0-19-507132-8,
> page 453.
>
> ==
> Fighter: A Pictorial History of International Fighter Aircraft
> by Bill Gunston
>
> page 30:
>
> "Communists tried to make sure that each fighter coming off the
> assembly line lacked a propellor, or some other vital part. Thus,
> the Armee de l'Air was seriously weakened in its desperate fight in
> spring 1940.  Moreover, its fighters were in most respects
> inferior..."
>
> (vii) Socialists support HMG's appeasement of Naziism
>
> Violet Bonham Carter "suggested that during the afternoon a
> few of use should draft a telegram to the Prime Minister
> adjuring him to make no further concessions at the expense
> of the Czechs and warning him that of he did so he would have
> to fight the Commons on his return".  The wire was to have
> been signed by, among others, Churchill .. Attlee, Archie
> Sinclair, Eden, Liddel Hart, Lloyd George, and Lord Lloyd.
>   It was drafted - eliminating the threat and at 7:00 PM
> they again met at the Savoy.  Winston then called for
> signatures, and Sinclair, Lloyd, and Cecil came quickly
> forward."
>
> Attlee refused to sign the telegram, declaring that he
> would need the approval of his party.  This suggests, then,
> that Labour's condemnation of Appeasement could not be
> taken for granted.  Lacking the broad base necessary,
> the telegram wasn't sent.  Nicolson wrote "As far as
> one can see, Hitler gets everything he wants".
>
> VBC continues: "Winston remained, sitting in his chair immobile,
> like a man of stone.  I saw the tears in his eyes.  At last
> Churchill spoke - "What are they made of?"  He was referring to
> the Appeasers, including Attlee.
> "The day is not far off when it won't be signatures we have
> to give but lives - the lives of milions.  Can we survive?
> Do we deserve to do so when there's no courage anywhere?"
>
> page 350, WINSTON SPENCER CHURCHILL  THE LAST LION: ALONE
>
>
>

>> Also, curious that the Church

>
> Funny that they did so when he put so many of thems in jail...
>
> "By the end of 1933 Schirach had co-ordinated most youth movements
> and steadily encroached on the few nonconformists such as Catholic
> organisations"
>
> NAZI GERMANY  A New History  Klaus P. Fischer.
>
> "Cardinal Faulhaber arranged for a personal interview with Hitler
> on November 9, 1936." ... "When the two men came to the topic of
> the racial Laws of 1935 and the sterilization of those who suffered
> from genetic diseases--two issues that had given rise to funda-
> mental differences on both sides--the fuhrer became angry and told
> the cardinal that he would not tolerate church interference in
> such matters."
>
> "official harrassment against Catholics continued unabated."
>
> "HUndreds of monks and nuns were pilloried in the press and, in
> the process and then arraigned in the courts on trumped-up
> charges ranging from financial malfeasance to sexual aberrations".
>
> "Joseph Goebbels, himself a former Catholic, orchestrated a smear
> campaign and, in the process, highlighted sensational charges of
> clerical immorality."
>
> "Hundreds of nuns and priests were convicted and sent to
> concentration camps".
>
> page 363, ibid.
>

>> and the rich supported Hitler,

>
> They did later, but the early character of the Nazi party was working
> class, and aimed at the working men and middle classes; that's why it
> is full of ...
>
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