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Re: Happy Halloween         

Group: alt.philosophy · Group Profile
Author: tooly
Date: Oct 28, 2007 04:48

"Hardpan" yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:cjh8i3leln7o23ieahaovdjmv8fhab1mki@4ax.com...
> On Sat, 27 Oct 2007 20:30:22 -0400, "tooly" bellsouth.net>
> wrote:
>
>>
>>"Sir Frederick" fuzzysys.com> wrote in message
>>news:iqc7i39uhpiimcuh26ml6h31uug1gnpj61@4ax.com...
>>> Happy Halloween :
>>> (The decider has his job.)
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>> http://www.lewrockwell.com/rozeff/rozeff183.html
>>> On Track for U.S. Collapse
>>>
>>> by Michael S. Rozeff
>>>
>>> Bush and Cheney are steering the U.S. into a collapse. Only strong
>>> public voices by influential people can prevent the coming disaster.
>>> We desperately need for men and women who are known to the public and
>>> have credibility to speak up in the critical period ahead to avoid
>>> catastrophe.
>>>
>>> * A few weeks ago, Israel bombed a alleged nuclear facility in
>>> Syria. This is a warm-up for an attack on Iran.
>>> * In the last few days, the U.S. unilaterally tightened sanctions
>>> on Iran. Russia and China do not support this move.
>>> * A week ago Bush warned Iran that its attainment of nuclear arms
>>> would lead to World War III.
>>> * Russia, which has been assisting Iran in its nuclear
>>> construction program for decades, regards Western military action
>>> against Iran as unacceptable.
>>> * China has been arming Iran with missiles. Its relations with
>>> Iran have been improving for years.
>>>
>>> We know that Bush and Cheney are capable of pre-emptive attack. We
>>> know that Bush will act if he believes he is right no matter what the
>>> costs are. In his distorted worldview, Iran with nuclear weapons is a
>>> scenario worth any cost to avoid.
>>>
>>> We know that Bush, Cheney, and Rice have repeatedly warned Iran of
>>> meaningful consequences if Iran arms itself with nuclear weapons. We
>>> know that their terms in office end in 15 months. These are the
>>> critical months.
>>>
>>> But it is by no means clear that the front-running candidates for
>>> office who may replace them hold substantially different views.
>>> Hillary Clinton has publicly called for sanctions against Iran and has
>>> called Iran a threat to Israel.
>>>
>>> Why may an unprovoked attack on Iran lead to WWIII and why may it lead
>>> to the collapse of the U.S.?
>>>
>>> Imagine this scenario. The U.S. encourages Israel to bomb the Natanz
>>> nuclear facility in Iran. Russia attempts to restrain an Iranian
>>> response but fails. Iran responds in any of many ways, such as
>>> launching missiles on Israel, firing on shipping in the Straits of
>>> Hormuz, mining the Straits of Hormuz, sending troops into Iraq, or
>>> allying its military with Hezbollah and attacking Israel from Lebanon.
>>>
>>> The U.S., citing Iran's aggressions (that will be the story), launches
>>> a full-scale attack on Iran designed to devastate the country. This
>>> attack has actually been planned by the U.S. for years. Syria is
>>> unable to maintain neutrality and quickly becomes a battleground
>>> between Iran and Israel.
>>>
>>> The price of oil by this point has already soared to $200 a barrel.
>>> The U.S. begins to use its strategic reserve and to divert Iraqi
>>> production. Russia responds by taking steps to prevent its oil
>>> production from reaching the U.S. China responds by cutting off its
>>> support of the U.S. Treasury market. Venezuela halts oil shipments to
>>> the U.S. The first stages of WWIII are economic warfare designed to
>>> cripple the U.S. and halt its war-making capacity.
>>>
>>> The U.S., unable to finance its deficits and fund its sovereign debt,
>>> is forced into raising interest rates drastically in order to borrow.
>>> The Fed is forced to print money. An inflationary spiral occurs.
>>> Meanwhile the high interest rates and high oil prices, not to mention
>>> the shock of a spreading conflict, drive the U.S. economy into severe
>>> decline. The U.S. attempts to raise taxes in order to fund itself,
>>> further crippling the economy. Gold soars to $1,500-$2,000 an ounce.
>>>
>>> The U.S. attempts to bolster its military forces. The draft is
>>> reinstated. The severity of the emergency allows Bush and Cheney to
>>> assume emergency powers and begin a dictatorship. Elections are
>>> postponed.
>>>
>>> The U.S. collapses.
>>>
>>> Unfortunately, even if this scenario does not occur, the position of
>>> the U.S. is so precarious that any number of other scenarios equally
>>> disastrous lie in wait. This house needs urgently to be put in order
>>> or it will fall, and especially if it does not terminate its imperial
>>> adventures. The very fact that Bush and Cheney (or any major U.S.
>>> political officials) gain by starting WWIII is a terrible indictment
>>> of our entire political system.
>>>
>>> Who can stop this? Who can prevent this? It will only take a few
>>> well-placed people to prevent this catastrophe. My guess is 5-20
>>> people could sway public opinion against war or provide enough cover
>>> for Congressional dissenters to screw up their courage. Maybe even as
>>> few as 3 or 4 influential people could derail the Bush-Cheney train to
>>> disaster. They need to speak out at the right times and they must be
>>> heard. Previously mute or muted voices simply must speak out. They
>>> know who they are. They know that their silence will mean silent
>>> approval of a U.S. collapse.
>>>
>>> October 27, 2007
>>>
>>> http://www.lewrockwell.com/rozeff/rozeff183.html
>>
>>Fair concerns.
>>But, does this mean the "sane" argument is that we allow Iran to have
>>nuclear bombs?
>>Action-Reaction. So, our best policy is what? No reaction?
>>
>>Who is the agressor? This needs to be clarified. Bush-Cheney here made
>>to
>>look like the war mongers. But aren't we in a similar situation of what
>>to
>>do about agressors in the world, much as Neville Chamberlain decided 'no
>>reaction' was best policy to Hitler's actions in late 1930's? Nah...given
>>all the options of reactions which I am sure well qualified and
>>intelligent
>>people will be looking at in this administration, perhaps the worst option
>>will be to do nothing. Once Iran has the bomb....I'd like to see that
>>post
>>and analysis. What happens then?
>
> Israel has at least 200 nuclear devices, most located on submarines.
>
> The US has thousand of nukes in silos or bunkers and on submarines,
> not to mention air-force bombers capable of dropping nuclear weapons.
>
> What do you think will happen to Iran should they actually use a
> nuclear device on a U.S. or Israeli ally ?

Good point you make here. A Theocracy would be much less inclined to act
'rationally' however. And consider how Iran is sympathetic to certain
terrorist groups. Funneling a nuclear device of some sort to such groups,
even Al Queida perhaps, would not be out of the question. I'm somewhat
certain that already, we'll probably wake up some morning in the not 'too
far off' future with one of our cities gone.
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