| Re: Democracy does not exist in the Modern World |
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Group: alt.philosophy · Group Profile
Author: pbamvvpbamvv Date: Oct 20, 2007 08:42
On 20 okt, 15:50, Fred Weiss papertig.com> wrote:> On Oct 19, 5:46 pm, Jerry Kraus yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> ...It doesn't have to be a one-shot deal, like giving Hitler dictatorial powers was.
>
> Unless of course your "national plebiscite" puts a dictator in power -
> which is precisely what happened in Germany and has happened recently
> in Venezuela.
>
> And don't tell me that a majority didn't vote for Hitler. A majority
> wanted a dictator, if not the Nazis, then the communists. So if one or
> the other hadn't grabbed power, civil war was likely (as happened in
> Russia).
>
> Such in fact is *inevitable* because unrestricted majority rule is
> dictatorship itself - the dictatorship of the mob. It embraces the
> principle and it is not made any better that the majority want it. The
> American system was designed to prevent that very thing and it was the
> greatest fear of the Founders. (One can see the difference clearly in
> comparing the principles underlying the American vs. the French
> Revolutions - the one leading to freedom, the other to the Reign of
> Terror).
>
> Do you think the majority of Americans wanted civil rights for Blacks?
> What do you think the majority of Americans would have done with
> Japanese-Americans after WWll - or Muslim Americans after 9/11? The
> internment of the Japanese-Americans would have seemed kind in
> comparison.
>
> Fred Weiss
Your opinion that the Majority of Germans wanted a Dictator was
interesting
the last totally free elections showed this results
National Socialist German Workers Party (NSDAP) 33.1
Social Democratic Party of Germany (SPD) 20.4%%
Communist Party of Germany (KPD) 16.9%%
Centre Party (Z)
11.9%%
German National People's Party (DNVP) 8.5%%
Bavarian People's Party (BVP) 3.1%%
German People's Party (DVP) 1.9%%
Christian Social People's Service 1.1%%
German Farmers' Party (DBP) 0.4%%
German Democratic Party (DDP) 1.0%%
Agricultural League
0.3%%
Reich Party of the German Middle Class (WP) 0.3%%
German-Hanoverian Party (DHP) 0.2%%
Other
0.9%%
The Nazi's and the communist together got exactly 50%%!
Of course after the Reichstag fire, the Nazis won more than the
communists lost,
those were no longer truly free elections.b you might very well be
right.
However I doubt that either camp would have voted for the others
leader -)
The inventors of Dictatorship (the Romans) were more intelligent than
to be handing out a passpartout to anyone. Their Dictators were in
power for a limited time, after which the senat would again chose two
consuls (who also were in power for a limited time).
When the princeps came in power they maintained the constitution
theoretically, but in fact they there soldiers made the senat
obsolete. So the rules didn't work like they were intended too. But
theoretically it was a good idea.
We should indeed always remember the roman republic as an example of
what makes a democracy. Not the perfectness of its legislation, but
the will of the people to maintain it. Any democracy can be overthrown
with the support of about 20%% of the population and about 80%% of the
army. It's when the soldiers are set on supporting democracy, that a
nation is save I suppose.
Peter van Velzen
October 2007
Amstelveen
The Netherlands
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