>
>>
>>>> Let's discuss this. You bring up chapter and verse, and we'll discuss
>>>> the
>>>> concept of redemption. Paying the cost to redeem and then your slash
>>>> which
>>>> is depictive of your misguidedness and you Applewhitian message. You
>>>> say
>>>> boldly, "is found in the Bible." We then put it on the table and we
>>>> will
>>>> all discuss your concept, instead of the shell of understanding that
>>>> half-baked teachers have led you to believe is enough.
>>
>>>> In other words, we will both put our money where our mouth is.
>>
>>> Can we first agree on a definition.
>>
>>> Redemption: 1.) to free from bondage or a debt,
>>
>> Yep
>>
>> 2.) to pay a price to
>>
>>> redeem an object that was lost or is going to be lost.
>>
>>> The first five books of the Bible have three direct references to
>>> redemption.
>>
>>> Lev 25:47-55 (a self-imposed slaves right to become free during the
>>> year of jubilee)
>>
>> I know that one very well, and the Jew that takes in such a slave
>> actually
>> becomes a slave to the slave in that he must provide the slave with equal
>> accomodations, and the rules are brutal
>>
>>> Ex 21:28-32 (someone redeeming someone else from a sentence of death
>>> due to mismanagement of an Ox)
>>
>> Yep, we can go into depth with this.
>>
>>> Lev 25:25-28 (redeeming a piece of land that was part of a families
>>> inheritance but was sold (or is going to be sold) by a different
>>> family member)
>>
>> You don't understand, Michael. What you are showing is the beauty of the
>> Jewish people and the depths they will go to please Hashem and it is a
>> clue
>> to Klal Yisroel being "one" and not a family of individuals.
>>
>> I've studied these very well, although halacha is out of the scope of my
>> prowess, but I learn bit by bit.
>>
>>
>>
>>> However, the concept of redemption can be seen in other stories.
>>
>> GET OVER THE "STORY" MENTALITY, MICHAEL. It shows your level, and with
>> your
>> brains this is not complementary.
>>
> You see to be offended by the word "story". Why? I believe it is a
> true account of what happened. Not all stories are false.
Because the Torah is the greatest Treasure on the planet. Story is like
calling a piece of gold a rock. They aren't stories, there are learning.
So deep, each one. Like your religion says we need to have "faith" like
Avraham. What you learn after years of study, is that Avraham was over
fifty when his uncle Noach lived, so Shem always had an Academy. Not only
that, Hashem spoke to Avraham. Now I can tell you I have a sister Veronica,
which I don't. You can believe that I have a sister Veronica, but it be
really stupid to say that "I have faith that I have a sister Veronica."
>>
>>
>>> God's freeing of the Israelites out of Egypt
>>
>> Yes, and Who did it, Michael? Hashem Himself, and this debunks the story
>> that he has to cow tow to the Sitra Achra, kill Himself and go to
>> Gehinnom.
>
> I don't know what your terms mean (Who do you mean by Hashem? Who is
> Sitra Achra, and where is Gehinnom?)
Gehinnom is like a pergatory, hell kinda. If you work on all your deficits
and really do tshuvah (repentence) in this world, the Olam Hazeh
you may not have to go there at all. But tshuvah is not six hail marys and
an our fther. It's when you really feel pain for your transgressions. Where
you feel embarrassed to Ha Kodesh Baruch Hu for your choices. The beauty of
this path, and the most difficult thing, is that as you go along you are
shown things that you had forgotten, and they hurt these mistakes. I have
suffered countless hours for hurting people. I practically saw how deeply
it hurt them. I know I'm rough here sometimes, but someone has got to say
no.
The Sitra Achra is a Kabbalistic interpretation of the soton. It is beyond
the scope of my understanding, I am not a Kabbalist. I do find that
addressing this situation with this word has more impact on my yetzer hara
(Evil Inclination). But according to most sages, the soton is just a
prosecutor. To others he tempts, the yetzer hara, he prosecute, and then
Melech HaMovis, the angel of death. He is all three.
>
> God's redemption of Israel out of Egypt was a foreshadowing of God's
> future redemption of all of mankind out of the bondage of sin.
>
Not all mankind. Sorry.
>>
>> Your sorry religion depends on Sinai.
>
> Not sure what this means. God gave a set of rules (via Moses) at Mt
> Sinai. Is there something else you are implying?
Take away the Torah, and then try to make sense out of the NT.
>>
>>
>>> Abraham's freeing of his cousin Lot from the 10 kings.
>>
>> See pull these learnings out to prove that Yeshke was anything more than
>> a
>> "bad Jew." I use this learning every day.
>
> Who is Yeshke?
The dead man on the cross.
Sorry.
>>
>>
>>
>>> One of the best accounts of redemption (in the old testament) of
>>> course is Ruth.
>>
>> The Testament is not old. We could discuss Ruth for days.
>>
>>
>>
>>> And one of the most graphic accounts of a (then) future redemption can
>>> be found is Isaiah 53.
>
> I would rather focus on the Bible. Do you not believe the passage in
> Isaiah 53 is true? If so what does it mean - to your understanding?
I'm not arguing missionary garbage.
Suffice it to say I have spent countless hours here, in Hebrew and your
interpretation is corrupt.
>
>>
>>
>>
>>> And one of the most poignant pictures of redemption is Hosea and his
>>> wife Gomer.
>>
>> Here is another learning that is so deep and yet you think you can throw
>> it
>> on a list. Now, if you want to work on Gomer or Ruth and the concept
>> and
>> I'm blanking on the word, which I know so well about the situation with
>> Tamar and Jehudah also. Darn it, I can't remember the word. I actually
>> have to look it up, its Leverite marriage, BRB
>
> What do you mean by deep? The story is rather simple? The Israelites
> rebellion against God was appalling to God. So he used the example of
> Hosea and Gomer to show them how appalling it was. Also it showed
> God's love in spite of their sin.
I Chronic
I'm eating up the paragraph below. BRB
t the people in the
> Bible were far from perfect, but that God worked through their
> imperfections. The while account (and it ramifications) could have
> been avoided had it not been for Er's wickedness. That each of the
> subsequent characters (including Tamar) also did wrong only shows
> their humanity.
>
>
>>
>>> By the way who is Applewhitian?
>
> Who is Applewhitian?
>
>
