Re: Can there be life on Sun?
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Re: Can there be life on Sun?         

Group: alt.philosophy · Group Profile
Author: Justintruth
Date: Aug 6, 2008 14:01

With respect to organic life like carbon based life on earth no... but
you don't mean that... you mean can there be other things...

One of the mysteries of life is that it seems to occur whenever there
is an information accumulation or in other words whenever there is an
ongoing decrease in entropy. In fact, one may posit a ongoing decrease
in entropy as a defining characteristic of life. That is why there is
interest with respect to computers as to whether they are alive
because they in fact can store information. We know that our brains
store information and we know we are alive so we can make the working
assumption that any ongoing ability to store of information will
result in some life form. This is an hypothesis not a statement of
fact. In a sense our lives are as a result of the sun loosing a little
of what it would need to support life and giving that to us. That is
why most life on the earth is dependent on a food chain that
terminates with light from the sun.

So your question becomes, could there be something on the sun that
could store information.

The answer lies, in my mind in the second law of thermodynamics. Life
on earth is dependent on energy from the sun because it then breaks
the isolation of the system and allows the buildup of information.
Without that you can't build information and given our working
characteristic of life you can't have it.

So there are two possibilities. One that an external energy source is
providing energy to the sun and that will allow the organization of
some form of matter or else that there is some zone on the sun that is
different from some other zone and that is receiving energy from and
internal transfer.

My understanding is that the sun is broadcasting energy and there are
no non-negligible external sources of energy. That would mean the sun
as a whole cannot be a brain.

The next question is whether part of the sun could. The problem there,
is to find some subset of the sun that is capable of storing
information in an ongoing fashion.

There does not appear to be states available in any of the physical
processes. In fact all of the models that I am aware of, I am not a
solar scientist but have only a layman's grasp of the sun, still all
of the models have the physics represented by statistical equilibrium
rather than a buildup of information.

So the real trick is to find some physical states that could be
organized in the physics of the sun. I am afraid I know of none. The
information in our brains appears to be stored in mechanical
structures requiring matter organized in the solid state. In other
words it is the arrangement of atoms into structures that appears to
be where the information is stored. This structuring is inherent in
the process of information storage. There are no such solid structures
in the sun as the heat would destroy them.

So in a sense the answer is simply that the sun, due to its
temperature, is far too fluid a place to have life. There are no
physical states that can receive and store information.

The one other possibility is that the sun, as it is part of larger
structures, could be like an atom is in a body, a piece of a much
larger sized brain. Unfortunately it doesn't look that way to me. When
we look at large scale formations in the universe it does not seem to
be organized into a computer-like structure. In fact it appears to be
more like dust than a structure.

So every way I can think of saying yes to the answer seems to have a
road block.

The only possibility left would be for the sun to support life without
corresponding physical organization. There is no current theory that
rejects that as an option but there is a problem with that. The
problem is that it could not communicate with us through our senses as
that would mean that the sun was somehow organizing and it is not. So
if there is life in the sun we won't be able to know it unless it
turns out there is non-physical communication.

If there is that communication, then there can be life in the sun that
is not associated with the physics of the sun but only associated with
its location. If you believe that consciousness requires the physical
arrangement of some matter, that life is inherently corporal, then
this is impossible. In any case I know of no one who has communication
from beings living in the sun and sense the burden of proof would be
on those that conclude that there is life there, then I conclude,
absent that proof there is no life there.

So again I keep coming up with the no answer.

Too bad. It would be neat.

On Aug 6, 8:38 am, Sanny hotmail.com> wrote:
> No, Never as it is too hot....
>
> I am interested in some Life form not made of Organic matter but
> something else.
>
> If someone says can there be life under Ocean. ignorant will say
> anyone who drowns in Ocean dies So no one can live under ocean. But we
> know fishes live under water with Gills instead of lungs.
>
> Life can take many shapes and sizes. It can be as small as an ant and
> as Big as an Elephant.
>
> Life can be fast as a bird or slow as a tree.
>
> Life is everywhere whether grass, air, inside our Body and can take
> any shape and be made of anything one can think of.
>
> There are many elements on the Sun in liquid state. Say molten iron on
> the sun works like water on earth.
>
> And the Life uses molter iron as its drink. and the food is the heat
> ernergy on tthe Sun.
>
> We see a lot of movement on the surface of Sun may be it is a Big
> ocean of Plasma and many creatures live under that hot plasma.
>
> Bye
> Sanny
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