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Author: KisaiKisai Date: Jun 11, 2008 10:01
*IB* continues his tour by introducing the reader to the power of
symbols in magic: aural, visual, and kinesthetic.
*IB* begins with the etymology of the word 'tantra' and delves a bit
into the history of Tantric Buddhism. Unfortunately, in doing so he
compares the spread of Mahayana Buddhism to Roman Catholicism which is
like comparing the proliferation of the useful herb of garlic in the
world to the voracious spread of the nutria in the southeast wetlands
of the United States. Despite some wacky sects, Buddhism grew in the
accepting soil of Hinduism and generally doesn't try to usurp other's
religions. Roman Catholicism grew from the doctrine of oppressed
monotheists and developed as a substitute government during turbulent
times.
Next, *IB* introduces mantra and the importance of names in magical
tradition. He mentions the myth of Isis wrangling magic from Ra by
finagling his true name from him. He also mentions the secret name of
YHVH, Sumerian mythology, and Rumplestiltskin. He then talks about
Kabbalah's love of names and grimoires as well.
*IB* exposits at length on mantra's, but unf., doesn't seem to get
exactly anywhere. He seems to hold the opinion that the mantra itself
is important, but its pronunciation is not, useful only for invoking...
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Author: NoindenNoinden Date: Jun 11, 2008 10:04
Ok I've held off, but Real Magic is a rather old book, familiar to
most, so why are we getting a blow by blow on this?
Isaac is opinionated but knows his stuff.
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Author: KisaiKisai Date: Jun 11, 2008 10:18
On Jun 11, 12:04 pm, Noinden gmail.com> wrote:> Ok I've held off, but Real Magic is a rather old book, familiar to
> most, so why are we getting a blow by blow on this?
Chade requested it. I wanted some more enlightening books, then
acquiesced.
> Isaac is opinionated but knows his stuff.
Eh. He superficially knows his stuff. As I said in the beginning the
book was popular because it promised egalitarism to the masses through
psychic powers at a time in which there was great hope for social
change.
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Author: NoindenNoinden Date: Jun 11, 2008 10:26
On Jun 11, 12:18 pm, Kisai gmail.com> wrote:> On Jun 11, 12:04 pm, Noinden gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Ok I've held off, but Real Magic is a rather old book, familiar to
>> most, so why are we getting a blow by blow on this?
>
> Chade requested it. I wanted some more enlightening books, then
> acquiesced.
>
>> Isaac is opinionated but knows his stuff.
>
> Eh. He superficially knows his stuff. As I said in the beginning the
> book was popular because it promised egalitarism to the masses through
> psychic powers at a time in which there was great hope for social
> change.
Actually having talked to the man, he knows his stuff.
Out of curiosity which edition are you working off?
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Author: TomTom Date: Jun 11, 2008 12:03
> On Jun 11, 12:18 pm, Kisai gmail.com> wrote:>> On Jun 11, 12:04 pm, Noinden gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> Isaac is opinionated but knows his stuff.
>>
>> Eh. He superficially knows his stuff. As I said in the beginning the
>> book was popular because it promised egalitarism to the masses through
>> psychic powers at a time in which there was great hope for social
>> change.
>
> Actually having talked to the man, he knows his stuff.
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Author: NoindenNoinden Date: Jun 11, 2008 12:19
On Jun 11, 2:03 pm, "Tom" comcast.net> wrote:>> On Jun 11, 12:18 pm, Kisai gmail.com> wrote:>>> On Jun 11, 12:04 pm, Noinden gmail.com> wrote:>
>>>> Isaac is opinionated but knows his stuff.
>
>>> Eh. He superficially knows his stuff. As I said in the beginning the
>>> book was popular because it promised egalitarism to the masses through
>>> psychic powers at a time in which there was great hope for social
>>> change.
>
>> Actually having talked to the man, he knows his stuff.
>
> I've actually talked to the guy too, and I'd say he knows some stuff pretty
> well and not so much other stuff. Magic is a huge field of study and there
> are some very different ways to approach it. Nobody has a lock on all of ...
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Author: TomTom Date: Jun 11, 2008 18:47
> On Jun 11, 2:03 pm, "Tom" comcast.net> wrote:>> "Noinden" gmail.com> wrote in message>>>
>>> Actually having talked to the man, he knows his stuff.
>>
>> I've actually talked to the guy too, and I'd say he knows some stuff
>> pretty
>> well and not so much other stuff. Magic is a huge field of study and
>> there
>> are some very different ways to approach it. Nobody has a lock on all of
>> it. His faith in psychic powers as the only secular explanation for
>> magical
>> effects severely limits his vision. His lack of scientific discipline
>> makes
>> for some glaring and obvious errors in judgment as to what is "real
>> magic"
>> and what is not.
> ...
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Author: NoindenNoinden Date: Jun 12, 2008 07:33
On Jun 11, 8:47 pm, "Tom" comcast.net> wrote:>> On Jun 11, 2:03 pm, "Tom" comcast.net> wrote:>>> "Noinden" gmail.com> wrote in message>
>>>> Actually having talked to the man, he knows his stuff.
>
>>> I've actually talked to the guy too, and I'd say he knows some stuff
>>> pretty
>>> well and not so much other stuff. Magic is a huge field of study and
>>> there
>>> are some very different ways to approach it. Nobody has a lock on all of
>>> it. His faith in psychic powers as the only secular explanation for ...
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Author: TomTom Date: Jun 12, 2008 09:57
>
> Heh I work in the pharma industry .... I don't mix anything (me
> included with) chemistry thanks!
"Without chemicals, life itself would be impossible." -- Monsanto slogan,
circa 1966
Your body is composed of chemicals. You ingest chemicals all the time. It
is a huge error to suppose that you are not part of your environment and
that your body is not a complex set of ongoing chemical interactions.
> Isaac is NOT part of any group as such (ie leading), I'm on record as
> saying for PIE, that I disagree with 90%% of what he says, but he
> provokes my thoughts more than almost any other spiritual author.
The intent of Isaac's work is not to provoke spiritual thoughts but to
secularize our conception of magic. Unfortunately, he can't do that very
well while mired in his own superstitions.
> Oh and for another record my area of interest is energy work more than
> magic (will never be spelled with a K by me unless I am taking the
> piss ;) )
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Author: NoindenNoinden Date: Jun 12, 2008 10:02
On Jun 12, 11:57 am, "Tom" comcast.net> wrote:>> Heh I work in the pharma industry .... I don't mix anything (me
>> included with) chemistry thanks!
>
> "Without chemicals, life itself would be impossible." -- Monsanto slogan,
> circa 1966
>
> Your body is composed of chemicals. You ingest chemicals all the time. It
> is a huge error to suppose that you are not part of your environment and
> that your body is not a complex set of ongoing chemical interactions.
Ok lets try this again.
I hold a PhD in synthetic Organic Chemsitry. I work in the Pharma
industry. I know this better than you me thinks.
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