93.

is there any evidence whatsoever that suggests magick performed to aquire
material things - money, women, power etc - actually works?

Dawkins spoke of a test involving a survey of people who pray and compared
them with non prayers and there was zero correlation between them, is there
a similar test with magick?

93s.

On 4/13/08 9:14 AM, in article kkqMj.54320$5o5.6284@newsfe15.ams2,
"Fervidus" blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

I'm not aware of any really good studies to date. The methodological
problems with that kind of assessment are enormous. However, my feeling is
that it would be relatively easy to demonstrate how readily people tend to
retrofit their magical goals to meet actual events in their lives. That is,
whatever happens is what they tend to believe they wanted in the first
place. There are a number of well known cognitive heuristics and biases that
facilitate that sort of thing.

Fervidus wrote:

You seem to be talking about supernatural powers rather than magick.
Crowley defines magick as "the Science and Art of causing Change to
occur in conformity with Will". By this definition, making a cup of tea
can be considered an act of magick. Crowley then gives this explanation:

"(Illustration: It is my Will to inform the World of certain facts
within my knowledge. I therefore take "magickal weapons", pen, ink, and
paper; I write "incantations"---these sentences---in the "magickal
language" ie, that which is understood by the people I wish to instruct;
I call forth "spirits", such as printers, publishers, booksellers and so
forth and constrain them to convey my message to those people. The
composition and distribution of this book is thus an act of Magick by
which I cause Changes to take place in conformity with my Will.)"

"Fervidus" blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message
news:kkqMj.54320$5o5.6284@newsfe15.ams2...

Not formally. Magicians, like psychics, tend to be very resistant to
allowing anyone to formally test their claims for such things.

On Apr 13, 12:14 pm, "Fervidus" blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

No.

Erwin Hessle, 8=3

Erwin Hessle wrote:

Why no? If you forced me to give a yes or no answer to that question I
would have said yes.

On Apr 13, 5:01 pm, Absorbed hotmail.com> wrote:

Present the evidence that you believe suggests this.

Erwin Hessle, 8=3

Erwin Hessle wrote:

If you take Crowley's definition for magick, then anyone who has
acquired material things intentionally has performed magick.

On 14 Apr, 10:18, Absorbed hotmail.com> wrote:

Intention is not acquisition.

The Speaking Clock wrote: