Eric H. wrote:
> This FAQ is generally posted around the first of the month and maybe
> around the 14th of the month. Sometimes more often when the traffic in
> the newsgroup is high, say, due to a recent television show on magic, or
> what-have-you.
>
> Thought for the day:
> "ask for a secret, you'll get abused"
> "ask where to learn or get more info about a secret, you'll get answered"
>
> 1. What is this FAQ's purpose?
> 2. Why is there more than one FAQ for this group?
> 3. What is alt.magic.secrets purpose?
> 4. What isn't alt.magic.secrets purpose?
> 5. What is the deal with this Bill Page guy?
> 6. How do I find how ....is done?
> 7. Is there a good list of books, videos or magazines?
> 8. Why did all these magicians rip my lungs out when I posted a secret?
> 9. Why did all these magicians rip my lungs out when I asked about...?
> 10. What are some things safe to post?
> 11. How do patents, copyrights, and trademarks cover routines?
> 12. What things will get me enough flame to make an asbestos suit
> worthless if I post them?
> 13. What are some effects/methods that are in the public domain?
> 14. What are some effects/methods that are protected?
> 15. How is flash paper/powder made?
> 16. What is a troll?
> 17. What do I do when somebody trolls?
> 18. What is and how do I *plonk*?
> 19. Can I make commercial posts in alt.magic.secrets?
>
>
> 1. What is this FAQ's purpose?
>
> To provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare and..wait
> that's the preamble to the U.S. Constitution. Really, it's to help
> define the boundaries of what is a trade secret and what is in the
> public domain to keep the number of flame wars to a minimum, as well as
> removing any myths involved with the newsgroup. Its purpose is NOT to
> teach you how to use the Usenet or your newsreader. That's another forum
> altogether and outside the scope of this newsgroup.
>
>
> 2. Why is there more than one FAQ for this group?
>
> Some people find that the other FAQ doesn't address many questions that
> are actually frequently asked and appears only to address the ego of
> the author, Tilman Hausherr; read it and see; one of his few updates
> came from my suggestion..why NOT to make flash paper. This one is
> written by myself but is revised promptly when new questions/answers
> arise.
>
>
> 3. What is alt.magic.secrets purpose?
>
> Some will say to reveal magic secrets, others will say that it is to
> keep those very secrets. In reality, it's a mixture of the two and
> should be taken with advice from a certified doctor. I'm not supporting
> either side because they are two opposing extremes and there are good
> points for both sides.
>
> 4. What isn't alt.magic.secrets purpose?
>
> To ruin a magician's career or put magic dealers out of business, no
> matter how unlikely.
>
> 5. What is the deal with this Bill Page guy?
>
> Bill Page is in essence a child in a man's body. He's harmless but can
> be annoying. If you find him unbearable there is no reason to
> complain publicly about him, just add him to your killfile to ignore him
> and be done with it.
>
> 6. How do I find how .... is done?
>
> Read a book, check the web, watch a video, go to a class, use some
> resources other than just being spoon fed the info. You can ask but
> don't expect any answers to be very informing unless you want to
> exchange secrets with other magicians.
>
> You can also try checking out Mitch Leary's Deja file. It has many cool
> ideas and tricks that may or may not be dangerous to your health. So, as
> usual, proceed with caution; it could cost you your life. He's got an
> awesome reading list that he posts once every now and again and you
> should find every book he mentions and read a thousand fold. Trust me, I
> own a mere 3 or 4 of these books and they have priceless information.
>
http://groups.google.com/groups?as ugroup=alt.magic*&as uauthors=Mitchell%%20Leary&num=100&hl=en
>
> 7. Is there a good list of books, videos or magazines?
>
> Yes there is, in the alt.magic FAQ Lots of other things can be found
> there too..
> The alt.magic FAQ is archived at:
>
>
http://www.learn-great-magic-tricks.com/
>
> (Note: Other sites appear to carry older, out of date, versions
> of the FAQ. The above sites are sent those parts which have been
> amended, near the end of each month and *should* be current.)
>
> For those who do not have a web browser, individual parts of the
> five part FAQ may be obtained from an auto-mailer. Send blank
> e-mail to: altmagic@
aaronjones.com for details.
>
>
> 8. Why did all these magicians rip my lungs out when I posted a secret?
>
> Probably because you posted a secret about something that they paid good
> money for and isn't in public domain yet.
>
>
> 9. Why did all these magicians rip my lungs out when I asked about....?
>
> Did you ask "Who fooled Houdini" "What is another name for the Elmsley
> count" or some other question posed by many magic sites to prove you're
> worthy of entry? Maybe you asked "How did
do..."?
> Many of the magicians in this newsgroup will chastise someone who
> doesn't want to spend the time to find, learn, and practice, or just
> plain *pay for* the trick in some shape, form or fashion. Do a simple
> web or google search before asking and maybe you will be accepted as
> someone who is knowledgeable and/or willing to expend the energy to
> learn.
>
>
> 10. What are some things "safe" to post?
>
> Methods that are in the public domain and can be used in other routines
> are safe to post. Your own routine is safe to post as long as you are
> the originator. Routines of other magicians are safe to post as long as
> they are in the public domain.
>
>
> 11. How do patents, copyrights, and trademarks cover routines?
>
> If a routine uses a specialized device/method for that routine, then
> chances are the device/method is patented. In the United States a
> "device" is not patented unless you apply for a patent and spend a
> couple $1000 and wait a year or two for the Patent Office to issue you
> one. It then assigns it a number and your full description of the device
> becomes public knowledge. The complete description is available at many
> libraries and on the internet at the IBM(*not* International Brotherhood
> of Magicians) site and probably at the US Patent site. If your novel use
> is not described in the patent such that a person knowledgeable in the
> field cannot understand it then it isn't protected by the patent. You
> cannot hide the patent number because until the patent holder makes
> known publicly the existence of the patent others may assume it is not a
> patented device and act accordingly. On the other hand, if you are
> talking a design patent then only the specific design is protected.
> Making relatively minor changes in the appearance of the device is
> generally sufficient to get around this kind of patent. This is where
> the grey areas begin though. If you use a common device/method but use
> it in an original routine then the routine is subject to copyright but
> the method is in public domain. So if Copperfield uses public domain
> device A with an elevator, he can copyright the fact that it is an
> elevator for the presentation, but I can perform with the same device A
> instead with a 69 Mercedes Benz and be free from any copyright
> violations from Copperfield. Trademarks cover names or logos, like
> "D'Lite" or "Mofo"(Penn and Teller's psychic primate). {note:needs
> editing but works for now}
>
>
> 12. What things will get me enough flame to make an asbestos suit
> worthless if I post them?
>
> Try posting how David Blaine did his latest routine. Actually, almost
> anything can start a flame war so if you can't handle the heat, post
> with extreme caution. Usenet is pure anarchy and there's nothing you can
> do to stop it other than to have a thick skin and asbestos suit.
>
> 13. What are some effects/methods that are in the public domain?
>
> [snipped directly from Andru Luvisi's wonderful suggestions]
> I don't think it's accurate to say that these are "sold as if [they
> were] unique invention[s]", but here are some old tricks that you can
> find in a magic shop:
>
> Several trick decks are described in The Encyclopedia Of Card Tricks,
> my edition of which is copyright 1937. The Encyclopedia Of Card
> Tricks can also be gotten for free from The Learned Pig Project
> (http://www.thelearnedpig.com.pa/).
>
> * Stripper Deck
> * Svengali Deck
> * Mirage Deck
> * Mene-Tekel Deck (I've heard that the Infinity Deck is related to
> this)
>
> Some trick decks which date back to the days of Sachs and Hoffmann:
>
> * One Way Forcing Deck
> * Electric Deck (See "More Magic" under the heading "To Spring the
> Cards from the one Hand to the Other (with Mechanical Pack)")
>
> The Brainwave Deck was invented by Vernon and is described in issue 49
> of The Jinx for October 1938. In The Encyclopedia Of Card Tricks,
> under the heading "A Super-Reverse Problem" you will find essentially
> the same trick but using wax instead of R/S. The Invisible
> Deck/Ultramental Deck is a variation of the Brainwave Deck that is at
> least as old as Tarbell 3 (1943 for the book), where it is described
> in the chapter at the end on mental magic.
>
> Marked cards are as old as the hills. Even Robert-Houdin mentions them!
>
> The principle of "McDonald's $100 Routine" dates back to Hofzinser
> (check out "The Power Of Faith" in "Hofzinser's Card Conjuring").
>
> According to T. A. Waters' book "The Encyclopedia Of Magic And
> Magicians" Ralph Hull died in 1943, which means that the Nudest/Mental
> Photography Deck and the Pop-Eyed Popper Deck, both of which Waters
> says he invented, are at least that old.
>
> Theodore DeLand, who according to Leo Behnke's booklet "Find The Ace"
> invented the oldest known gaffed Three Card Monte, died in 1931
> according to Waters. The trick was called "Pickitout" and used
> misprinted indices. I have seen this trick under several names over
> the years.
>
> Of course I've barely scratched the surface with the above, but it may
> be enough to get you started.
>
> [if you, the reader, have any additions, changes, etc., please either
> post them or preferably email them to me]
>
>
> 14. What are some effects/methods that are protected either by
> copyright, trademark, or patent?
>
> [Thanx to Mitch Leary for posting these]
>
> Steinmeyer's Origami Illusion: Patent #D345,595
> http://www.delphion.com/cgi-bin/viewpat.cmd/USD0345595
>
> Adam's Mirror Production Box: Patent #4,023,794
> http://www.delphion.com/cgi-bin/viewpat.cmd/US04023794
>
> Magician's Anti-Gravity Boots: Patent #5,255,452
> http://www.delphion.com/cgi-bin/viewpat.cmd/US5255452
>
> Theatrical Levitation Device: Patent #4,244,566
> http://www.delphion.com/cgi-bin/viewpat.cmd/US04244566
>
> Tenyo's Inexhaustible Cigarette Drawer: Patent #4,557,476
> http://www.delphion.com/cgi-bin/viewpat.cmd/US04557476
>
> China Change & CSB Type Coins: Patent #3,822,879
> http://www.delphion.com/cgi-bin/viewpat.cmd/US03822879
>
> Tenyo's Phantom Clock: Patent #5,886,936
> http://www.delphion.com/cgi-bin/viewpat.cmd/US05886956
>
>
>
>
>
> 15. How do I make flash paper/powder?
>
> First answer, you don't. You lose 4 or 5 fingers first trying like an
> idiot to save a few bucks and then you buy it from a magic shop like you
> did before.
>
> Second answer. It's basically the first answer but with more info. Flash
> powder(the stuff that flash paper is coated with...a generalization to
> be sure but for the purposes of the stupid..it'll do..) is EXTREMELY
> dangerous and is the hardest pyrotechnic to make without injury to
> yourself or others, and that doesn't count improper use once you're
> done. With that being said you can find it in "The Magicians Arsenal" by
> Lee Scott or rec.pyrotechnics. If you need to know more, I have some
> more info that used to be in this sentence's place but now probably got
> overwritten by some accident. So either write me and ask or wait for
> more info as I find it.
>
> Now, if all the warnings don't deter you, read this next part.
>
> A friend of mine who is both a magician and an experienced pyrotechnic
> decided that he would make his own. He made it successfully and had been
> using it with awesome results for a while and then one time he had a
> piece between his hands(they were palm to palm) and when he opened them
> quickly the sudden rush of air(oxygen), combined with the heat from his
> hands, set the stuff off in his hands, no flame/spark needed. After this
> he quickly used his remaining stock and vowed to just save the fingers
> and buy it.
>
> This same friend told me about a company that a few years ago was
> advertising that they had flashpaper that had different colors of flash.
> There was apparently a huge demand so some BIG magic dealer put in an
> order for tens of housands of dollars. One month passes, no paper; two
> months, no paper; three months and everyone is starting to get worried
> as to whether they were ripped off so they start investigating. Then
> they found out what happened. There had been so much demand that they
> were in soo much of a hurry that they skipped some safety details and
> promptly levelled their entire facilities. If you've ever seen what a
> pyrotechnic's site looks like, it's generally spread over several acres
> to eliminate the possibility of this.
>
> In short..Flash is dangerous and it's manufacture needs to be left to
> professional pyrotechnics.
>
>
> 16. What is a troll?
>
> It's name is derived from people fishing and that while they are moving
> in a boat, they let their bait "troll" behind them in hopes they'll
> catch a hungry fish. And that's basically what happens, someone puts out
> a very controversial post that will attract a lot of posts in anger or
> what-have-you. They quite often also put very inflammatory subject lines
> on their posts in an attempt to "grandstand" and try to make their
> trolling more effective.
>
> A good person to start ignoring is Tilman Hausher since he's not a
> magician and you should share no magical knowledge with him.
>
> I used to have a list of other trolls here but I simply decided that you
> can determine for yourself if you think someone is not serious about
> this newsgroup by the way they are rude, insult, overreact(actually
> attacking someone's character for no real reason when the person is
> simply asking a "newbie" question or simply disagreeing with their point
> of view), drone on and on about things that have nothing to do with this
> newsgroup(especially topics that are already heavily debated like
> politics, religion, etc); and they don't have to use vulgar language but
> that can be the case.
>
> Though it isn't always reliable, it can be helpful to see what the
> opinion of the overall group is toward this individual's posts by
> reading responses to their posts or posts made about them. In using this
> method for research, be certain that you're reading more than simply 2
> or 3 people who dislike this person since we're not all friends here and
> even a troll can have people who agree with him/her on a couple of
> topics(the old adage of a stopped clock being right twice a day comes to
> mind).
>
> Many that I used to list here will be discovered to have these
> traits that you will see repeated within 10 hits of a search. Here's
> the link to do your own search if you don't already know how..
>
> http://groups.google.com/advanced group search?hl=en
>
>
>
> 17. What should I do if somebody trolls?
>
> Trolls need attention and they starve if you don't give them any so
> ignore them and maybe *plonk* them.
>
>
> 18. What is and how do I *plonk*?
>
> Plonking is putting someone in your killfile so you can ignore them. How
> do you do it? For *how to *plonk* in 23 newsreaders see Killfile and
> Anti Troll FAQs at http://www.hyphenologist.co.uk/killfile . If you
> reader isn't listed, RTFM(read the fine(or f---ing) manual) and then
> tell the person who runs the page how to do so...
>
> 19. Can I make commercial posts in alt.magic.secrets?
>
> A: Technically, you can make any post you wish in an alt.* heirarchy
> however as a courtesy to those who frequent the newsgroup, it is
> requested that you add the following to the beginning of a subject line:
>
> AD:
> If you are simply posting an advertisment, use the AD with a full colon
> after the letters.
>
> FS:
> If you are selling something, use this to indicate an item For Sale.
>
> FA:
> If you are posting an item for auction or link to an item for auction,
> use this to indicate that it is For Auction.
>
> FT:
> Use this if you are indicating an item that you are posting is For
> Trade.
>
> If you use the full colon after the letter combination, those who want
> to filter out based on FA:, FS:, FT:, or AD: won't miss any posts with
> subject lines containing words that have those letter combinations
> without the full colon such as FAilure, soFT, ADmit, and others.
>
> Example:
> AD: Just Released - Porcelain Cups and Balls!
>
>
>
> Thanx to all who have contributed to this FAQ even if you are unnamed.
> There is much more to add here and I hope to have time in the upcoming
> couple months to get the editing done.
>
> To do:
>
> Define what does and does not count as "protected" in many contexts.
> Add more questions as they are asked.cool erick:)
« How to work out 90%%+ of magic effects (Essential) » Hey, bp, you
have 7 messages, 1 is new.
Oct 11th, 2006, 8:30pm
Home Rules Magician's Vocab Classic Effects Videod Effects Magic Links
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Tip: Use the links above to find the key info here quickly. We're both
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WARNING: DO NOT POST WORD FOR WORD COPYRIGHT DESCRIPTIONS OF MARKETED
EFFECTS OR USE EXACT TEXT FROM BOOKS/INSTRUCTIONS OR USE THE
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MAY BE BANNED.
Disclaimer: The descriptions of effects represent mere conjecture and
discussion about how the effect might be achieved. They do not
necessarily relate to the actual methods used. For the definitive
methods, please obtain the actual effect in question. The best place
for this is a reputable magic dealer and we encourge our readers to
check out the dealers/sales section. The information is posted for
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How to work out 90%%+ of magic effects (Essential)
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Author Topic: How to work out 90%%+ of magic effects (Essential)
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bp
Magician
member is online
Posts: 135
Re: How to work out 90%%+ of magic effects (Essenti
« Reply #15 on: Feb 19th, 2006, 11:42pm »
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
cool yep look every way in the illusion ideas
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Naruto
Magician
member is offline
Now You See But Now You Don't
Gender:
Posts: 234
Re: How to work out 90%%+ of magic effects (Essenti
« Reply #16 on: Mar 28th, 2006, 1:19pm »
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
that's another way to find the loop hope.
save the video and edit the video using window movie maker. quiet
useful
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Everything that has a beginning has an end.
Jaypoc
Moderator
member is offline
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Posts: 488
Re: How to work out 90%%+ of magic effects (Essenti
« Reply #17 on: May 1st, 2006, 3:58pm »
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
on Jan 21st, 2006, 10:42pm, ubizmo wrote:Not long ago I bought a trick
online because I couldn't for the life of me figure it out from
watching the video. It's the "vanish in the air" effect from the
magician's entrance at
http://newmagicsecrets.com. I watched it over
and over, frame by frame, but couldn't spot the move.
I've learned about different gimmicks this way.
I saw a street magician perform the Invisible Deck and while I knew
there had to be some gimmick, I couldn't fathom how he could fan out
all of the cards and have my verbally chosen card be the only one
flipped opposite of all the others.
I picked up a deck at the local magic shop and was blown away at how
simple the trick really was.
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Nedster
Assistant Magician
member is offline
Posts: 31
Re: How to work out 90%%+ of magic effects (Essenti
« Reply #18 on: May 19th, 2006, 6:50pm »
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This is great post. Thanks for all the good advice.
Tom
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doulos
Magician
member is offline
Gender:
Posts: 102
Re: How to work out 90%%+ of magic effects (Essenti
« Reply #19 on: Jun 7th, 2006, 11:17am »
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I think the ones that are in the 10%% we can't figure out are due to the
lack of handling we expect, or the simplicity of the gaff/gimmick or
lack thereof.
I remember this macthbox thing a fellow magi showed me. He got it at
convention. I kept thinking it was something in the box itself, until
the drawer opened up by itself. I didn't want him to reveal it, but
when he finally did I couldn't believe that it fooled me. But there ya
go. I was in the audience place for once.. it was cool.
James
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VotePI
Sorceror's Apprentice
member is offline
Posts: 7
Re: How to work out 90%%+ of magic effects (Essenti
« Reply #20 on: Jun 19th, 2006, 7:48pm »
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Another simple tip:
Always look at the simplest moves. A hand in the pocket, or the
grabbing of the hand, or just simple instructions after saying "do as I
do."
That's where the magic happens
Usually, when they do a "magicial move" such as shaking or waving, it's
meant to be a distraction from the move that had already been
completed. Yeah, I know, I am the master of the obvious
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pwn247
Magician
member is offline
Dear Criss Angel, I AM NOT A FAN! EVER!
Gender:
Posts: 111
Re: How to work out 90%%+ of magic effects (Essenti
« Reply #21 on: Aug 19th, 2006, 08:50am »
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
# whatever:
if they are sawing themselves in half, and they have a box around their
abdomen, say to yourself
"if they're so pro, why do they need the box?"...
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Magic:
Use what you know.
Criss Angel:
Know what you use.
oldognewtrx
Assistant Magician
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Posts: 69
Re: How to work out 90%%+ of magic effects (Essenti
« Reply #22 on: Aug 20th, 2006, 3:43pm »
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Great thread ! I do this automatically whenever I see something new
without thinking about it, but I fail to give it the necessary time to
work it out quite often. WOW , to think , I never followed through to
give it the time necessary. After all the times I've tought and
preached "follow through", I have overlooked it in a situation where I
should have been especially applying this wonderful concept. Perhaps I
have looked at Magic as too much of a hobby, when it truly deserves to
be consumed like a private business venture. I pledge to shift my
paradigm to become a good magician ! Thank you for the insight.
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bp
Magician
member is online
Posts: 135
Re: How to work out 90%%+ of magic effects (Essenti
« Reply #23 on: Today at 8:30pm »
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Steinmeyer Sells YOU Out to the Man
« Start of topic « Older Messages 1 - 2 of 2 Newer » End of topic »
Fixed font - Proportional font
1 From: mitchell leary - view profile
Date: Wed, Oct 11 2006 9:34 pm
Email: "mitchell leary"
yahoo.com>
Groups: alt.magic.secrets
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Well kids, even Uncle Mitch had to take a second look at what just
happened. And I have to say that what has just been released to the
public for pennies on the dollar has me gasping.
I paid $175.oo for a copy of THE MAGIC OF ALAN WAKELING, and have seen
copies on e-Bay go for over a grand. You can now buy this book (soft
cover) over on Amazon.com for $13.57 !!! You heard me right, PEANUTS!
You can also buy another major illusion book, ART & ARTIFACE for
$10.17.
These are two very, very important books on magic and offer some of the
best kept secrets you'll ever find. If you don't have these books they
will now be offered in every bookstore in the world.
The world has gone mad.
-Leary-
Reply » Rate this post:
2 From: cooltobe...@webtv.net - view profile
Date: Wed, Oct 11 2006 9:53 pm
Email: cooltobe...@webtv.net
Groups: alt.magic.secrets
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- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
mitchell leary wrote:> Well kids, even Uncle Mitch had to take a second look at what just
> happened. And I have to say that what has just been released to the
> public for pennies on the dollar has me gasping.
> I paid $175.oo for a copy of THE MAGIC OF ALAN WAKELING, and have seen
> copies on e-Bay go for over a grand. You can now buy this book (soft
> cover) over on
Amazon.com for $13.57 !!! You heard me right, PEANUTS!
> You can also buy another major illusion book, ART & ARTIFACE for
> $10.17.
> These are two very, very important books on magic and offer some of the
> best kept secrets you'll ever find. If you don't have these books they
> will now be offered in every bookstore in the world.
> The world has gone mad.
> -Leary-
i got hidding the elephant
wow! thanks mitch and hey stein myiers cool in my bookalso
hesthe illusionist he thought of david seth kot kins statue of lierty
vanish and reapear idea illusion
http://magicsecrets.suddenlaunch3.com
http://wwwthemaskedmagician.com
theres masked magicians illusionst magicians every where cool
david copperfield.franz harary, johnathen pendragon, chris angel, lance
burton, blackstone, blackstone jr, mark wilsom, princess tenko, melinda
the first lady of magic, the amazing kreskin, the amazing johnthen, pen
and teller, valintino, david blaine, street masked magician on fox, the
new masked magician onfox they say he will be back and this time he is
a pro,2 abc secrets specials
andre kole on the magician staring bill bixbie
http://www.wilds.org
http://www.tvmagicguide.com
Reply »
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latest effects & performances or those of others- Illustrated Magic-
Guess how it's done- Demonstration/Show off Forum------------------=>
Specific Secrets Discussion.Focussed posts only. Members only for
methods discussion areas. Read the Rules before
posting.------------------- So how is that done?- Grand Illusions-
Mental and Mindreading- Stage and Street Magic- Close up Card Magic-
Close up Coin Magic- Other Close up Magic- Children's Magic Forum-
Beginner's Magic Forum- Flourishes- Zen Magic, the Occult, Spiritulism,
and Psychism- Related Magical Arts------------------=> Off topic fluff,
Password forum, Old threads, Sales and Wants, Members
section------------------- Ha ha, off topic you know it, so post it!-
Password protected forum. Guest posting allowed. Any subject.- Secrets
of Magic Members only Forum- Sales and Wants. Online magic shops- Oh
no.... not THAT thread again!- Contests and Competitions- Locked
thread
------------------=> The Inner Sanctum------------------- Inner
Secrets Forum- Board Administration- New Inventions and ideas Forum
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